08.01.08 2008 - the Year of the Electric Car?
Would you consider getting an electric car?
The beginning of a new year is usually the time for resolutions, spring cleaning and a renewed sense of optimism, but 2008 has got off to a miserable start so far.
In quick succession, oil prices hit $100 a barrel, npower announced it was hiking prices by 27%, and British Gas looks set to be the first to follow suit.
The anxiety over a looming energy crisis, increasing fuel prices, and the knock-on effect this has on petrol, food and other commodity prices, has been brewing for some time now. The voices that maintain that we cannot continue to consume energy at the rate we currently are (let alone increase consumption) are getting louder. New technology, such as the electric car, has been touted as a way to sustain our current lifestyles, but has so far has failed to make any considerable impact. However, with electric cars on the market that boast acceleration of 0-60 in 4 seconds, the idea that we could all be driving electric cars and filling up at power stations rather than petrol stations is not as far in the future as you might think. Could 2008 finally be the year of the electric car?
Electric cars are not new. Before Henry Ford invented the petrol powered car, electric vehicles (EVs) were a common form of transport. By the 1960s petrol cars had effectively forced their electric cousins into extinction, but growing concerns about a fuel crisis have sparked a renewed interest in electric cars as a more efficient, environmentally-friendly method of personal transport. Early forays into the consumer electric car market, notably the EV1 by General Motors, were scuppered by high prices, a poor range and a lack of public support (although many felt the EV1 was never really given a chance). Hybrid technology, a combination of electric and petrol power, was heralded as a compromise, and by 1997 the Toyota Prius was available to the general public. It was the first mass produced and commercially marketed hybrid car, selling 18,000 units in its first year. It is still a popular car today, thanks to a variety of celebrity endorsements, and demonstrated that the public appetite for alternative transport does exist.
But environmental purists argue that hybrid technology doesn't go far enough – that it is simply lip service to the concept of greener transport. Luckily, 'pure electric' vehicle technology has advanced enough to make EVs for the masses a reality, without compromising on speed, power or style.Electric cars have had a bad press in the past from petrol heads, because they often fall down in fundamentally inportant areas – price, performance and aesthetics. However, a new wave of EVs are about to hit the market which will change all that, and some EVs are already available at affordable prices. The G-Wiz is one of the most popular EVs in London because of its compact design. It costs less than £9000 brand new, and as little as 1p per mile to run – G-Wiz claim it pays for itself within a year. It's practical, and has all sorts of money-saving benefits, but with a range of 48 miles, it's not exactly practical for anyone living outside a big city. Plus, it looks like (and has the street cred of) an oversized frog.
The Mitsubishi i-EV, although still in development, is slightly more attractive that the G-Wiz. When it does hit the UK, you'll be able to drive over 100 miles before needing to charge it again, and as with the G-Wiz, it will cost around 1p a mile to run. An average tank of fuel for a petrol car costs £40 - for the same price you can get a year's worth of energy in an EV. When you do the sums, turning your back on petrol seems a very attractive prospect. Unfortunately though, there seems to be no release date as yet, but you can register for alerts in the meantime.
The Phoenix Sports Utility Truck, however, is available to buy now. Happily, it looks less like a toy and more like it means business – it can do 0 – 60 in 10 seconds, with a full car, and you'll get over 100 miles from one charge. It's top speed is a much more respectable 95mph, and you can get 250,000 miles from one battery. At the moment the company is focused on the fleet car market, so there are only a limited number of cars available to the public (the public of California, that is), but like so many things, where the US goes, it is only a matter of time before the UK follows.
The G-Wiz and the Phoenix are both practical, everyday cars, but another criticism often directed at EVs is that they're not fun – they're purely functional. This is simply not true anymore - there are cars on the market to rival even the super cars. The Tesla Roadster, assembled by Lotus in Norwich, gives you a glimpse of what is now possible. It offers 0-60 in 4 seconds, with full torque available from the moment your foot touches the pedal, and a top speed of 125mph. One charge will take you 250 miles, and in case you get caught out, it comes with a mobile charging unit, which uses an ordinary 240v wall plug. The only problem is getting hold of one – there's a pretty big waiting list.
But if you are interested in getting an EV, and you want to get on a waiting list, the Lightning car is the one to be on. It won't be cheap (the deposit alone is £50,000) but it will be a landmark in British automotive engineering when they are delivered in 2008. The Lightning will be a luxury 2 seater sports car, with over 700bhp and a top speed of 130mph. It promises to do 0 - 60 in 4 seconds, and have a range of 250 miles per charge. It might not be a economically viable option for the majority of us to start with because of the initial price tag, but if we are capable of producing cars like this today, it will only be a matter of time before the price drops and production increaces. And more importantly, what will we be capable of tomorrow?One of the main attractions to all the EVs above is the fantastically low running costs. There are a few areas where EVs positively triumph over petrol cars. First, they're exempt from road tax because they have no emissions. In London, EVs are also exempt from the congestion charge, and are often entitled to free or heavily discounted parking. There are even a number of free charging stations dotted around the city in case you get caught out. To reduce the cost of charging an EV at home, you can sign up to special green energy tariff, which reduces the cost of power at night, so it can cost as little as 40p for a full charge. On top of all this, EVs are in the lowest insurance group, and as a company car they are charged a mere 9% tax. If UK petrol prices are making it too expensive to run a car, electric cars are surely the way forward. And in addition to saving money, you can feel smug about helping to save the environment. Assuming they are charged using renewable sources, all the cars listed above are carbon neutral. And they release no pollutants, making the air cleaner for everyone.
Electric cars are the future of motoring – very few people are prepared to give up their personal transport, and as fossil fuels die out (or become too impractical to rely on), EVs will be there to fill the void, without compromising our current lifestlyes. The gap between EVs and petrol cars is closing fast, and it is only a matter of time before the performance of the Lightning becomes as cheap as the G-Wiz, and before the UK follows the US in terms of availability. It won't happen overnight, but with increasingly impressive tech-specs and a growing army of followers, 2008 looks set to be the year that we reach the all-important critical mass of supporters, and start to accelerate towards a cheaper, cleaner future.
What do you think? Do you think electric cars are the future of transport? Would you like to slash your fuel costs and save the environment at the same time?
Your Comments
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What's the point? Environmentalists wouldn't want a nuclear power station so we wouldn't end up paying duty and VAT on electricity.
Don't you mean would????
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Sure the emissions are moved from the exhaust pipe to the power station chimney but is is far easier to clean / control the emissions from a single source than from 1,000,000 exhaust pipes.
Anyone with a genuine interest in electric vehicles should visit the Battery Vehicle Society at :-
http://www.batteryvehiclesociety.org.uk/wordpress/
EVs were doable in the mid-nineties, the EV1 from the States would have been a great commuter vehicle, had GM not killed its own baby. Back then, fuel costs were cheap, very cheap. So who wanted a green mobile? Sure, it was cheaper, but people would see you as a silly hippy.
Now, it's not so silly. Two-hundred miles range is more than enough for the majority of commuters, and with modern lithium based power cells and the possibility of hybrid Plug-In Electric Vehicles (PHEV) that have a very efficient diesel to complement the electric motors for longer duration driving, it's even more sensible.
Of course, as another poster mentioned, right now even the Prius, fondly admired by environmentalist groups, isn't that green. The batteries are resource hogs to make and dangerous to dispose of. The thing is still made with fossil fuels, so while it is more efficient, it can't be considered truly green or non-FF dependent. Even if we had the money and resources and time to all get EVs (and leave only HGVs with efficient diesels or turbines running what bio-fuels we can muster without starving), the problem is that we don't have the base load power capacity in the UK, and neither do many nations. We rely a lot on natural gas which is also peaking just after oil (the npower price rises being a good early warning). Even with the newly announced nuclear plants, a thankful addition to our grid, they'll only be making up for other stations being decommisioned before 2015.
I fear we don't have the time to pull off such a project, for oil is already peaking. We don't have the money, because to replace the majority of cars in the developed world with EVs is easily tens of trillions of dollars, ignoring the current financial collapse we face to boot. We don't really have the energy either.
Unfortunately, this is a time of converging crises. Peak Oil is one of them. Were it not a problem that oil was running out, the other economic and resource based peaks will make it just as tough along with climate change which is really the only reason many want an EV or hybrid right now. When they see the energy crisis loom right here, right now, then climate change will be the last reason they want change.
I'm actually in the process of developing a number of electric cars so I'm pleased to hear that many of you would consider buying one. :o)
I wouldn't mind an electric car but it is up for a huge battle. I get a range of arround 700 miles on a 60 litre tank diesel megane. to swap that for a 250 mile electric car is going to take a lot of convincing. Maybe if it costs half of what todays cars cost.
I have a little worry though. Looking at other rechargable items such as mobile phones or cameras. The older they get the shorter the battery life seems to become. Would that be the same with an electric car? I wonder how it could be avoided.
With Npower hiking its prices by 27%, the cost of running this car has theoretically increased by 27% even before it is launched. So no difference between the price increases on diesel then!!!.
How exactly is this "alternative" power?, most of the production of the UK's electricity is done via burning fossil fuels and if the masses did switch over to the Battery powered vehicles then how is this going to effect the output from power stations and of course the capacity of the national grid? with many millions of battery chargers all being plugged in at around the same time.
There are usually dire predictions during cold winters where the utility companies are predicting gloom and doom in relation to not having enough capacity to cope with increased demand, so how is this going to effect running your new battery powered car?
I've also yet to see a commercially available battery which can fully charge in the time it takes to fill a standard car with fuel, so i'm not sure how 'charging' stations on supermarkets and motorways are going to work. Yes, 'fast' charging does exist but it usually comes at a cost of battery life, and in much smaller capacities than those which would be required to run a battery powered vehicle.
Cost of replacement batteries would also be a factor, a friends father has just replaced a battery on his milk float....at a cost of £2500
Hmmmmm
There are many people who would welcome an electric powered car I'm one of them.
I've even considered purchasing an old milk float, mounting a five foot wind turbine on my garage roof and offsetting some of the cost that way.
Fair enough the wind doesn't blow all the time, but having two sets of batteries, would mean one set were always on charge when the wind was blowing, even if one set were hard mounted in the garage to operate as a capacitor to replenish the vehicle from stored charge.
The remaining charge would have to come from the national grid and I wouldn't be paying fuel duty so I very much doubt we'll be allowed to go ahead with these cars all the time the current administration is still paying for illegal wars and need our money so baddly.
The science element of solar energy made a huge advance with the developement of the 'solar turbine' a series of mirrors focused on an electric generator mounted in a specially developed fluid that heats and rapidly rotates a generator. Two of these devices about the size of a couple of double decker buses stood side by side mounted together can generate enough electric energy to support a small town.
Obviously their operation depends very much on sun light, which seems to be quite plentiful in desert areas of the planet.
Perhaps thats why the british are becoming quite so interested in africa lately.
We're bored with the middle east, they haven't got much oil left ...but lets still all the sunlight the africans have got.
The likely hood of these cars becoming widespread is probable in Fifty years time.
My experience of thirty years plus in the motor trade tells me that the basic motorist will forget to charge the car, not bother to get the thing serviced and go completely bananas when they get the bill.
Further more with the political scene as it is you will have to take it to a garage (main dealer) and pay through the nose for their "qualified licensed technician" to work on it. these are far more technical than a milk float.
You will be ripped off as the parking for electric cars only bay has a charging point which like a credit card petrol pump, you insert your card remove it and then when you leave the bay the loop on the bay works out your charge. That is if you have removed the charge lead first. your electricity used will be much more than at home. Unless they will provide a subsidy for your enviromentally friendly vehicle.
One of the best cars I saw in 2007 was a Hummer H1 the original beastie that takes up more than it's fair share of the road! It had the engine removed and replaced with a 300HP fuel cell. The company that built it, then drove it around the City of London (and Red Ken's parish) - but as it is fuel cell powered there was no congestion charge! Brilliant
The electric car is good in theory. However, as mentioned, manufacture of the batteries is hardly the most environmentally friendly industrial process. I reckon keeping my old 9 year old petrol car going is better than scrapping it and buying something new running on huge batteries.
Lets look at the practicalities. I don't have a garage and rarely get a parking space right outside my door, so running a cable from the mains is an impracticality (as is the fact that the bloody kids round this area would probably muck about with it, or someone would trip over it and sue you - even running a vacuum out is impossible).
The power stations in this corner of the world are exclusively coal fired, which isn't that environmentally friendly.
As well as earlier mentioned, ipods, laptops, digital cameras etc. batteries degrade during use and have a limited life span. Disposing of these is also quite intensive, and expensive to replace.
The range isn't there either. I could theoretically take my petrol car tonight and drive to Moscow, Monaco or Africa, filling up along the way. An electric car would require charging every 300 miles or so for a few hours, hardly practical for those who do high mileages.
The technology just isn't there yet. Would put my backing behind hydrogen power, or even perhaps controlled fusion, both of which I believe could be a viable option by now if it weren't for pressure from the powerful oil companies. Remember the atomic age, Ford I believe had a prototype of a nuclear powered car. Wouldn't fancy getting involved in a crash with that.
probally not the place, but i am just back from gibraltar, diesel 54.8 pence per litre
I am interested in buying one of these electric cars. when the range increases to 120 miles and the battery really does last for 150,000 miles it will be just the job. I have just retired so in 10 years I will be on my uppers as the cost of living rockets ahead of my pension. I tried four times to register an interest but it didn't work. Has anybody else found this? Maybe because I didn't have a works number it recognised that I was a poor old pensioner who wouldn't be able to afford it.
What about the new air cars that are due to be built and released shortly? There was an article about them in Readers Digest this month. The web site is theaircar.com
Unfortunately, electric cars, hydrogen power, LPG etc might be the answer to a cleaner sustainable future, but it will have zero effect on fuel prices. I'm sure you appreciate that if the government suddenly start losing billions in petrol & diesel revenue, the alternative fuels will get hit with similar duties to make up the shortfall. I'm afraid the poor old motorist is going to be a soft easy target for a long time to come. Simarlarly with Road Tax, once people have switched to low emission vehicles, the government will ditch road tax and impose road tolls. The end result is we will all pay more for driving low emission vehicles than we currently do driving gas guzzlers.
My own view is that if everyone swapped their gas guzzler for an electric car tomorrow, it would have about as much effect on global warming as a gnat pi**ing in the Thames has on rising sea levels.
Don't give up the petrol campaign!!
It will not matter one jot, electric, fossil fuel vegetable oil whatever you run your vehicle on the government will find some way of taxing it, just look at the price of LPG compared to what the price was when it was first introduced.
i would buy one,why can't these cars be charged by solar panels during the day and small wind turbines at night,surely with the know how these days,possibly giros fitted to each wheel giving instant charge ,the know how probably is there for these cars to run constant but does big brother want us to have them-big money lost if we all drove electric cars,might stop alot of the wars in the middle east though
Electric cars have a fundamental number of problems:
- batteries and their life cycle
- autonomy
- performance
-... and cost of energy - yeap, electricity isn't for free!
A credible and real alternative is still to be revealed. Something around hydrogen, but don't know how.
In the mean time:
- use motorbikes and bikes
- create a proper good telework legislation and force it please
- improve public transportation and lower the prices
Cheers
It does nt matter what fuel your vehicle runs on. The parasites that we call the government will have their snouts in the trough when it comes to duty on whatever fuel your vehicle runs on whether its bull**** electric gas petrol water or diesel. the biggest problem we have is too many vehicles and people using vehicles inappropriately like taking kids to school in a 4 wheel drive when the school is only 200 yards from their doors . People do not want to get off their often fat backsides and walk more than 5 yards. People pay lip service to environmental issues except when it applies to them. This smacks of hypocrisy of which we are all guilty. Unless peoples attitudes change very quickly sooner rather than later, we will not be posting our views on this or any other forum in this very sad and sorry world
The theories good- BUT as a previous poster points out environmentalists won't be happy if more fuel burning or nuclear power stations have to built to provide the power surge.
The best solution is to reduce commuting need by a providing jobs close to available workforce, providing affordable home close to jobs (especially in places like London, Edinburgh, Devon & Cornwall) and improving access to public transport and alternative options car pooling, company shuttle, school buses for people to curb the need for car use. We also should be increasing penalties on lazy car use (under half a mile) by changing the taxation system by scrapping road tax and replacing it with fuel tax- so pay and go principles apply and motorway, major route tolls (extra vignette like Austria, Switzerland etc) or toll gates (like France, Spain)
If electric cars are to be taken seriously they need to be usable and viable outside of cites and stylish/practical enough for everyday use- noddy cars like the G-Wizz etc just don't work.
Whilst I understand that electric propulsion is a viable means of personal transport, I would like of see the development of an electric powerplant that would be a swap in unit for the existing engine in todays vehicles.
The cost implications of having to replace all the vehicles (over time) is incalculable and for many will be unfeasible.
I do hear the concerns of some that electric vehicles do not alleviate the pollution problems, but surely a well maintained, modern, efficient power station (which we need for other energy requirements) is a better solution than having millions of cars, in various states of tune and condition creating the pollution.
just my two cents.
Electric cars may be cheaper to run, but they still have a huge environmental impact plus they are not good for long range driving.
It obviously takes some sort of energy to generate the electricity in the first place to recharge the car, excluding hybrid models that energy would be fossil fuels, nuclear or hydro all of which have an impact on the environment in one way or another.
If more people start using electric cars then the revenue from petrol and diesel fuels will drop and as soon as the government catch on to the fact they are loosing money, they will come up with some sort of electric car charging tax or increase the tax on petrol and diesel fuels or invent a new tax to compensate.
Also it should be thought about recycling at the end of the electric car's lifespan, there are different components required with a lot of mixed metals plus more lead required for the batteries, where will it end up?
The government want us to go green, but at the same time the public transport options are not improving and what transport is available is too expensive anyway.
Transport taxes such as motorway tax and congestion charges are fine if the money goes back into improving the roads but it won't all go back, it will end up be diverted elsewhere.
It all comes down to the fact that the people in the government who are making decisions have no idea what happens in the real world and quite frankly are idiots.
It's about time that the government and councils of the UK are held accountable for all money wasted in schemes that never quite worked out.
I work in the automotive industry and I know that a lot of research is currently going in to greener engines. Cars manufactured in the UK are improving in quality, emissions, consumption, style every day and I say be patient. Only things certain in life are death and taxes, so we might as well accept that, but back our British manufacturers and "cheaper" cars are on the way by 2010.
charge these cars with free electricity, from solar panels on the house/garage roof.......any surplus sell back to the grid.......
COME ON ....WAKE UP GOVERNMENT,,,,,,,,More grants for solar!
60 million people, x 1000watts. each ..= .........errr......well a lot of electric!
check out youtube........"what are we waiting for" video
regards Brimoy
Yes this has got to happen . I run a number of cars including a very quick Merc but I just love driving [ AND PARKING ] my Smart Car .
65mpg and £35 road tax . We need to end the bullshit and just cut our rediculous fuel consumption which is in anycase promoted by the oil companies. I would just love to give OPEC a headache , they really deserve it . By reducing consumption we will of course reduce the supply cost of petrol because our oil producing friends will need to maintain cash flow to fund their lifestyles.
I am happy with the basic principal of reducing harmful emmissions, but it seems to me that going electric is only transfering the problem from the vehicle user to the energy provider. In terms of energy it is a well known scientific fact that you don't get something for nothing therefore most forms of motive power are inefficient to varying degrees. All for the current viable forms of powering a motor vehicle have little to choose in terms of their carbon footprint, after all this is what it is all about.
I read a very interesting artical which appeared in a number of trustworthy publications. This was a study which had been conducted to assess the carbon footprint, from manufacture to scraping, of many of the popular cars, 4x4s and hybrid vehicles currently available. The results indicated that the vehicle with the largest carbon footprint was a hybrid vehicle with the lowest emmissions, and the one with the smallest footprint was a 'gas guzzling' 4x4. Now why does it not surprise me that this study has not been given equal air time to that of the 'ban the car' lobby.
It's time for some of the surpressed designs of motive power to be dug from the vaults of the oil companies where they have been gathering dust for years.
I thought Britain was the home of the worlds motoring heritage. If so, why should we give up on fuel when it can be so much cheaper if the government didn't take such a big cut of it. As for electric? No way would I buy one. I like my classic cars. Cheap to insure, relatively economical - ish and free road tax, and a whole load more fun than any new car, petrol or electric!
Ultimately an electric vehicle is only as green as the electricity it consumes.
If you buy green tariff electricity like me then you can run an EV with a close to zero carbon footprint.
At the moment green electricity only makes up about 4% of all UK electricity supplied. To increase that level, demand needs to be higher so that more investment is made into it.
So the first step is easy. Change to green electricity at your house.
Cars have 4 wheels, so why can't someone come up with a solution to the charging battery problem, by getting the four wheels to charge / top up the battery as the car is being driven along, therefore reducing the need to 'plug in' the car to charge the battery, but hey I'm only a woman, surely there is someone out there with the know how, and the get up an go, to get out there and invent something :-)
There is also the new GM electric car.
It will use a small (1 litre or smaller engine) to charge the battery. The battery will then power the electric motor. It can then get 60mpg - but also be a plug-in. Therefore, you can charge it from home - or if you don't, it'll be just a plug-in hybrid. But if your commute is less than 40miles (the range of the electic battery) then you will NEVER need to buy any petrol to power it.
This sounds a good solution... ie. people can still do the trip across country to their relatives - but also get the electric powered commute.
Also - the new "super" batteries used in the Lightning, the GM car, etc are Lithium Iron Phosphate and are 100% safe. They do not explode when over-heated / short-circuited / shot like standard mobile / laptop batteries. Search for Valence Technology/a123 systems/nano phosphate - all 3 companies are pioneering these batteries.
They can also cycle for over 2000 cycles to 90% charge - ie. 2000x50miles = 100,000miles!!!
I think that electric cars are ideal for local running but due to recharge time make them unusable for distance
I would love to have an electic car or any other car fueled cheaply. Unfortunately what ever fuel becomes the front runner the Goverment will tax it accordingly
Electric cars... Sounds great... BUT, at what price. (a) for the car? (b) for the ever increasing electric bills???
Dont forget the TAX...
The National grid in the UK can only just keep up with current power output, and there is a HUGE energy gap forecast for circa 2012, based purely on extrapolating our current domestic and industrial consumption. It would be completely impossible to service the needs of even a fraction of even the current vehicle parc if they were electric rather than fossil-fuel-powered vehicles. It would be possible to service the needs of electric vehicles if we put the necessary nuclear infrastructure in place (renewables wouldn't have a prayer of servicing the need), but - this is important - WE HAVE TO PUT THE INFRASTRUCTURE IN PLACE BEFORE THE CHANGEOVER TAKES PLACE, OTHERWISE THE LIGHTS WILL GO OUT!!! The changeover to nuclear will take around 30 years, so yes - electric cars will indeed be viable. In 2040.
I HAVE TO ADMIT A CLEAN ELECTRIC CAR WOULD BE GREAT BUT THE COST OF THE POWER IS FAR IN EXCESS OF PETROL,AND THAT IS WITHOUT THE GOV, ADDING ON THEIR SHARE,
Why should people who have spent £££ on their cars be forced to change models?...
Its about time someone developed engines for the older cars, that were greener, thus, cutting down on waste... too many things are throw away nowadays, cars becoming one of them.
I love my car and have made many modifications, just wish someone could produce new cleaner engines for our older cars.
I personally dont see how battery cars would be any better.. power grid glitches every now and again when under high demand... God help it with millions of cars being charged up. And for sure as stated before , the UK.Gov will make us pay just as much for it sooner or later...
I am a firm believer of 1 house... 1 car and drivers over 60 having to resit a driving test. That would go some small way at cutting down on polution, cars on the road etc.
Whatever will be will be, I will personally drive my car until it dies...no matter what the government says or does.
Since when did Henry Ford invent the petrol car?
Think is, OK the range has increased a bit (250 miles) but this isn't exactly far so they are still commuter cars really. How long do they take to charge up ?
As someone already pointed out, where would the electricity come from - our existing oil and coal fired stations? No benefit (probably worse off) environmentally. The greens don't like Fission nuclear, public don't like wind farms (after years of getting rid of pylons and putting cables underground who can blame them) so wheres it going to come from. Fusion was also mentioned - cleaner yes but technology? Cost? Long way off.
Whatever is done won't make much difference as glabal warming is a natural event anyway. Mankind likes to think he's in control but nature still rules!!
"Slash your fuel costs" yes by all means, the environment? stuff the environment, there making a mountain out of a mole hill!!
Nothing to do with electric cars, but if we were all to boycott the two largest suppliers of petrol and diesel, because it is they who set the prices we pay, and get all our colleagues to do the same, then they would be forced to lower their prices and the others would have to follow suit. So get busy with those emails!
Helen Fletcher: What you propose is impossible. It would be a perpetual energy device, in other words, like having a light that powers itself with a solar panel. Thermodynamics: There ain't no such thing as a free lunch, and charging an electric car is nothing like the battery being charged in an internal combustion engined car via alternator.
In any case, someone stated 50 years for such cars to be adopted. There won't _be_ cars in 50 years. The collapse caused by energy prices and then their decline in production will end industrial civilisation based on fossil fuels. Even if the frankly doubtful can be done, and we replace all fossil fuels with renewables and nuclear in that time globally and without hiccups, it won't mean happy motoring carries on. These are the death throes of such rampant motoring we are seeing. Petrol, diesel, electric, air or flywheel, all these options are useless without the industry behind them. And the industry sure can't grow or even continue to exist with the end of fossil fuels.
And even if we could all have electric cars and the peaking problems approaching had no effect, the eventual problem of 9 billion people all wanting to drive their own cars will bring a chaos all of its own. Just look at Tata's Nano unveiled this week for the billion Indians to enjoy. Now imagine every developing nation getting those things, however small and economical, for their citizens.
Electrically powered cars are finally coming of age. The bigger question is where do we get the electricity from? Its seems to me that the only clean, zero carbon way of producing that electricity is nuclear power. The alternatives are not realistic; the whole country covered in wind turbines and wave powered generators begs the question, what are we saving the environment for? If the power station burns fossil fuel, we're merely transferring the point of polution. Its time we moved past the Chernobyl disaster and faced the technological challenges that safe, clean nuclear power presents. We can then look forward to cheaper, secure energy and almost eradicate carbon emissions at the same time.
maybe we should take a stand against these fuel prices, if you change to electric or any other fuel do we honestly think this government would not tax us as they already do,NO!!! we should stop it now, I for one would back someone to the hilt!!
i've already bought an electric scooter. no tax, no mot and cheap insurance. 30 miles on a charge, which is fine for me. electric car would be the next step. bring it on.
Can someone tell me what the effects of the Hydrogen ,the batteries give off
to the climate change. If the Hydrogen has the same effect on the enviroment as the emissions frompower stations, and car exausts whats the point of changing
Let's be honest. We'll keep complaining and we'll keep paying for petrol/diesel whatever the cost. After all, we're British!
I'm not going to chage to electric anytime soon and no doubt most other will not also.
It's about time that someone in government said, "we will eliminate our need for fossil fuels by the end of the next decade" in the same way Kennedy said theid have someone on the moon by the end of the decade. Action is required NOW otherwise we'll be sitting here in 10 years still complaining.
We need to be thinking beyond electric transport. What happens when all these batteries need replacing, are we going to end up with a battery mountain just like the fridges!!No doubt we'll be taxed for disposal.
Sorry but we need to think of the future for our kids and their kids. Now I love my car and it I love pushing, but that pushes the MPG down to about 12-8! I would love an EV!
Burning stuff won't get us anywhere and will just ignite more "wars on terror"
seen the film " chain reaction". anyone with low cost energy would be "frowned "on by the oil giants. profit runs the world.
Maybe electric cars are a good thing but they are not for me, The oil thats been extracted so far is only a drop in the ocean to whats left. Some people have mentioned the cost of a barrel of oil and the greedy petrol companies, Well i think fuel is dead cheap its the extortionate tax thats put on it by the greedy government, if you take off the tax the fuel is only about approx £1.50/£2.00 a gallon.
I could go for some of the EV's I've seen but the 'bugbear' about EV's is the limited total distance. Stopping and knocking on someone's door and asking to plug your car in for an hour or two is not a likely option.
I can just picture cars driving along the road dragging their cable along behind them and tripping up unsuspecting pedestrians. Also cars stuck on garage forecourts waiting for the AA having put in 50amps AC instead of DC!
will it not be possible to create a hybridising kit, which can be fitted by trained mechanics, at a cheap price to all makes of car.
yea it would be kool to have this economical electric car, but i believe the cost will be expensive, and the big corporations and the government will take advantage of this to exploit the consumer, thats the way the world works!!
As I drive a sports car I want the choice to drive my car by petrol.
May I use an analogy! We are told advised to use low energy light bulbs, so when we do, we have to turn up the heating thermostat in proportion the the lack of heat generated by the tungsten bulb, and also as more people are complying with this farce, the revenue shortfall to the energy producers is offset by raising the cost of electricity. The lie of man made global warming, and the false solutions become obvious. The general public, or the masses, whichever you chose will not be allowed to benefit. EVER. The only real truth is global profit and greed.
what i want to know is when we do get a reliable electric car which holds four adults and a big boot, what will the government do about tax's for these new cars !!!, they will lose alot of revenue so it will have to come from some where.
maybe car designers should be looking into converting standard petrol cars in electric ones, thus no more build up of bloody new cars on our already chocked up roads
I THINK ITS ABOUT TIME WE SHOULD STAND UP AND BE COUNTED RE FUEL TAX AND ENERGY COYS PROFITS
I don't believe electric cars are the way forward for reasons mentioned above, i.e. movement of pollution to power stations, the production and disposal of batteries, etc. We would be much better investing in ethanol production - existing cars can be converted to run on it and the only products of its combustion are carbon dioxide and water. No risky nuclear material, no sulphur dioxide. Lets not forget the decades of development the internal combustion engine's had - wouldn't it be a waste to dispense with this? Internal combustion engines may be less efficient than electric motors in terms of energy, but in terms of fuel costs and overall pollution they're more efficient (less any tax of course - which will happen to any fuel, remember how cheap diesel was?).
I thought this site was about petrol prices and finding the best prices etc. Are hauliers, farmers and other transport companies still going to stand by and be walked over by this government whi want to run this country into the ground. The fuel protest made some inpact, but why has their not been a more concerted effort been made by all of you concerned, and you Brendan why have you and all you collegues not made a greater effort and make the government take notice.
The day is coming when people will die because of fuel price increases of all description will make those vunerable unable to pay, All i say is you have the clout, so stand up and be heard...............
the French are working on a compressed air car at this date they have got it to run for 200 km on one charge and can be charged very quickly
What a lot of people miss,either by choice or by accident is nobody is willing to give up their space they call a motorcar. If we all did for a week,the government and the oil companies would suffer. Then they would either hike up the cost of fuel to keep up the profits or drop them to keep us happy. I dont see any of us doing it for 1 hour,let alone a week.To beat the taxman i've bought a cheap,small engined car,plus i use my bike when i can. Pay as little as possible everyone.Cars are here to serve us,not us to be slaves to the car. Technology is out there to keep our planet safe but its not ready for the public to have until the oil has depleated. The oil companies know when that'll happen.All the crappy little cars out their that are meant to be green are just to keep us happy to drive our foul smelling cars. Steam is a powerful energy,gas too.We have Hydrogen,electricity and whatever else is out there. In time things will get better when it comes to greener vehicles.I feel sorry for the person who buys a new car these days becouse they'll all be scrapped when the new generation of vehicle are born. See you in the future!! I'll be whizzing past you in my chip fat run diesel while you push your ferrari to the local motor museum.
Sorry but eletrics cars at the moment are just a gymic. I also can't stand Prius drivers who always blast down the motorway at 90MPH (Yeah they are really saving lots of fuel, I've seen one prius driving at the speedlimit and thats it hundreds of others think they own the road). I do think the hybrid is a better solution as you get the best of both types of engine and motor but put a bloody diesel in it and a decent battery.
Since the Government has finally come around to admitting that nuclear power is the answer to dwindling energy resources and the climate change conundrum and is launching into a programme of building nuclear power stations, the concept of the electric car is very practical and advantgeous.
I would be very interested in obtaining one provided the cost is not prohibitive and the range is aequate.
I am a senior citizen, so don't have a lot of money to throw about, but I have made a start, to day I went out and bought a new car, well to me it is although it is second hand it is PETROL and I am trading my older DEISEL car in as part exchange, I know its not a lot but it will make a small difference, I remember when Petrol was 50p a GALLON and that doesnt seem so long since.
Obviously electricly driven vehiles will become the norm if only because fossil fuel will eventually run out forcing us to develope other means of power. I would certainly have one if the power sourse was polution free. However I cannot see that sourcing the electrial power from nuclear stations is any cleaner in the long term, than burning fossil fuel and there is a much greater potential for disaster.
I have long believed that when storage batteries became efficient and light enough, manufacturers would begin to make electric vehicles. maybe that day has arrived. Also as has been previously pointed out the manufacture of the storage batteries is not exactly a green industry. Are our jugernaughts to be powered by electricity? Get freight back on the railway.
Perhaps Dr.Feltham is correct and that nuclear fusion is the answer to the dilemma. Is it polution free? I'm sure he is correct about the taxation angle. I think there is still a lot of work to do.
Well said, Helen Fletcher post 30
I agree with you 100%, surely with todays technology some clever person could devise a way of topping up the battery as the car travels along, this would as Helen as stated stop us having to use the national grid to top up at home.
The milage would then be unlimited... Yeah! :-)
I have been thinking about electric vehicles for quite a while. the only major disadvantage of an electric vehicle that I can see is the time it takes to recharge. I think the solution could be quite simple. The batteries should be interchangeable. Everytime you need to recharge you go to the "charging station" where the old battery(s) are slipped out and identical fully charged batteries slipped in! this is similar to the principle of taking an empty gas bottle back to the camping shop and exchanging it for a full one. If the batteries are fitted with smart technology the empty battery can state how much residual charge it has when it is taken out, so for example, if it had 10% charge remaining, you could get a 105 credit on the price of the replacement full battery.
The battery could also have a charge and discharge counter so that once it has gone through a certain number of cycles it is withdrawn from service and sent for serviceing/recycling.
If all vehicles used the same size of standard batteries and a method of quicly exchanging them was found (I suggest they are flat and stored under the floor of the car so that the new battery slides into the car from say the left and the old battery slides out of the car from the right) the "refuelling" if necessary to continue your journey, could be carried out as quickly as refuelling with petrol.
Well done for getting the debate going, keep pushing. All Best Andrew
Its ironic that most the money saving devices on the market are available to the rich not the working class. Why doesn't our goverment give grants or ev cars tax free. we all needto save money but its only the rich who do and can
Well I am a 40,000 mile per year driver, and with diesel now at £1.09 per litre around here I have already made my choice. I have ordered a bio diesel processor, and with the donation of used veg oil from my local chippy, I will be totally fuel self sufficient by the end of the month. I expect my fuel costs will now be around 20p per litre. Plus I will be carbon neutral!
The main problem with petrol cars is there has been little improvement to fuel consumption. Most car still only do 30 mpg. I see no reason why engines for a standard car should not be able to do twice that. If car do twice the MPG then price per mile would be better.
I would love an electric car but if you go away to places were you cant plug a car in limit distance. without have solar cells on car roof to help charge the car.
The goverment profit too much from taxes on fuel. Americans does not stand for it but we do. in the past 5p a gallon got front page news, now it does not.
Car companies dont do enough to provide car that get better milage.
customers can only buy what is made if price makes the company more profit that makes the car limited to those with lots of money over thinking of the enviroment.
But can you trust Governments? I remember the days when diesel was much cheaper than petrol - until diesel cars were produced for private motorists. Not long before Christmas, petrol was 94p per litre. When it hit the £!.00 mark the price rose by almost 1p per day and now, in some garages has reached £1.07 Likewise with diesel which is now £1.12 You can be sure that our Treasury criminals will soon latch on to a new form of registration fees, road tax, insurance tax, electric charging tax and banning the use of domestic energy for re-charging. Yes, I am a cynic and a pessimist but I am invariably right.