22.08.06 If parking isn't a crime why should I pay a fine?

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219 comments 4982 votes

It used to be that there were yellow lines in places where you were obstructing traffic flow and if you parked on them you got fined which is fair enough. It was a criminal offence after all and they were there for a reason.

Have we got too many yellow lines?

But in 1991 a new act of parliament gave local councils the power to decriminalise parking enforcement in their local area and collect the revenue for themselves.

In effect parking penalties changed from fines for crimes to another stealth tax all over the country.

Should parking be made a crime again?

People were so used to parking being illegal that they didn't realise the change had happened as everywhere in the UK started to get covered with yellow lines.

In my view councils should be putting lines down to manage the traffic and reduce accidents. But instead they are drawing extra ones to make money.

A bit like speed cameras but the big difference I do mind is that if you get caught speeding as with any other crime you get a fair trial before an independent court. If you want to argue with a parking ticket your first port of call is the Council who issued it and after that a body called NPAS which appears to be funded by Manchester Council.

It's a bit like your employer paying for the Judge at your employment tribunal against them, all wrong!

Have our Judges lost their power?

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You should be able to park your car on roads that have adequate space for the traffic to flow freely. I don't understand why some roads have a few spaces for parking and then yellow line the rest of the road......?
It shouldn't be difficult to get London moving again!

Posted by Gisela Charilaou, 23rd August 2006 3:45pm

Parking is a major issue. If everyone played fair and didn't obstruct the roads we could all have free passage along the roads. Bear in mind that yellow lines are there only to cater for the selfish who would just please themselves and clog up the roads.

Posted by Clive Smith, 23rd August 2006 3:50pm

Locally(Hunstanton) we have not had a traffic warden (except for perhaps 1-2 weeks a few years ago) for some very considerable time. And,of course, our local police are never on foot so do nothing to control 'illicit' parking.
Consequently there is ,by and large, a near total disregard of yellow lines.All they do is to cost money for the paint or in some cases provide reserved parking for those witjh passes,many of whom are a d*** sight more mobile than myself.
So in our case there is a very strong case for an extremely critical review of the lines.Again in general one is bound to admit that the 'illicit' parking does no harm for the main part.
If only we had a Chief Constable who paid attention!

Posted by G.h.allen, 23rd August 2006 3:55pm

Look carefully at your parking ticket(s).

The *LAW* says that they MUST have the time and date of the CONTRAVENTION ***AND*** they *must* also have the date of issue.

If your ticket does not have those 2 dates (even though both dates will most likely be the same) as well as the time of the contravention, then ***The Ticket is LEGALLY DEFECTIVE and you should not have to pay the fine***

Write to the ticket issuer citing the requirements of S66 RTA 1991 (as ammended). The Law of the country says that a ticket has to have those 2 dates, else it's not a valid PCN.

As a prat from the safety camera partnership once told me when I asked why such oppressive enforcement: "The Law is the Law and we cannot pick and choose which parts we should obey."

What's good for the goose....

Tell your friends about this. Keep your money in your pockets

Posted by Paul From Barking, 23rd August 2006 3:56pm

Parking is I agree an issue - however does it justify the article in the national press whereby a parking warden slapped a ticket on a vehicle that had crashed and landed up on a yellow line. There is too much of the old saying ''more than my jobs worth'' to turn a blind eye. We need wardens properly trained to know what is right and what is wrong.

Posted by Dae King, 23rd August 2006 3:59pm

The problem is that everything is run by Accountants these days. The days of the human touch have been removed. Humanity and humility have been replaced by the � sign.

If anarchy ruled the roads it would be gridlock and chaos... However, what's wrong with showing compassion and turning the odd blind eye.

It wouldn't be so bad if the rules were imposed fairly everywhere. But we all know of areas where the rule of the jungle is more important than the rule of the road. Abuse of parking and even driving laws are flouted without fear of consequence but woe betide me if I'm 5 minutes late back to the meter!

Posted by Martin Pearson, 23rd August 2006 4:18pm

This comment has been removed as it was found to be in breach of our Blog Policies.

Before paying a parking fine, check everything is correct. Do the yellow lines on the road concur with the plate on the pole? Is the name of the road where you are parked correct on the ticket? Is the time of the "offence" correct (can you prove you were elsewhere)? I have got off three parking charges in the past because of irregularities!

However, what is becoming more annoying is people parking on corners of roads. It may mean you have to swing around the offending vehicle possibly onto the other side of the road. The trouble is with parking places so scarce people just park in any vacant spot.

Posted by Martin Rosen, 23rd August 2006 4:35pm

What i find anoying is the many different tyes of car park. Some are pay and display, and they are the ones i hate. T ones with the barriers are fine you can't possibably get in without getting a ticket and then equally you can't get out without paying for it. It was only recientlt that i recieved my first parking fine. It was in a multi story pay and display and i was in a bit of a rush put a �1 in the machine & didn't clock that i needed to put in another 50p for the time that i was going to be there. As i was walking back to the car the parking wardens were walking towards me already having visited my car. The thing was if i'd had a bit more time and could have afforded to wait 15 mins it would only have cost the �1 that i put in. equally if it had a decient barrier system that most places seem to be getting now then i would have paid when it was time to leave & i would never have got the fine.

I'm not trying to get out of paying for the time that i have parked or want to park for it just seems excessive to get charged �15 ? for what is genuinly just a simple mistake.

These days with time at a premium rushing from A to B and then on to C, D & E etc it seems more & more likely that errors like mine are going to occur If the barrier ticketing system was put in everywhere then everyone would pay for the time that they are actually parked for even if it was only for a quick stop 20 - 30 mins i can't see the counsil loosing out if anything they will gain.

Posted by Fred J Best, 23rd August 2006 4:44pm

Why is it that when the new privately run traffic wardens come to light in West Bromwich, absolutely loads of Double Yellow lines were removed and simply made into parking spaces that have to be paid for.

I was under the impression that Double Yellow lines were there to enable vehicles to safely travel on that road ???

Posted by Steve Riddle, 23rd August 2006 4:46pm

Yellow lines, especially double lines are now painted virtually everywhere, even on roads which are suitable for parking. I believe they have been placed there to force the ever harassed motorist into yet another car park, where payment charges continue to rise. Llanelli in South Wales is a prime example where the greedy council is now raking in even more money from all the car parks in the town, thanks to a recent revamping of lines everywhere. If you overstay the limit or don't pay, you get fines. If you break into someone's home though, a first offender just gets a caution and NO monetary fine. As usual, the long suffering motorist is the easier target!!!
Something is really wrong somewhere.

Posted by Jeff Davies, 23rd August 2006 4:47pm

This comment has been removed as it was found to be in breach of our Blog Policies.

Roads are built for driving not parking, parking is tolerated if space allows, if you park badly or ilegally expect a ticket.
Why are the Police allowed to park on the pavement, different law!

Posted by David Playfair, 23rd August 2006 4:51pm

I agree with Martin about where people park. The trouble with too many yellow lines in an area is, conversley if no yellow line is marked it must be OK to park irrespective of what obstruction or danger that may cause.

Posted by Ray Harrison, 23rd August 2006 4:53pm

1 have travelled over 1.5 million miles over the past 55 years in many country's, and it is becoming increasingly difficult to drive safely in this country because of the state of the road surfaces, full of potholes, ridges, furrows and the like. instead of looking out for,and avoiding people and attempting to judge their intentions with their charges, whatever they maybe,cars ,cycles,motor cycles,prams,skate boards, feet etc., we now have the added task of preventing these obstakles from throwing us off course. . is it not possible to use some of this motor tax income to allow our councils to repair all defective roads, pavements,cycle tracks over the next five years ?. think of the saving possible for the nhs, if only we make a small improvement to the safety of our people. suggestion : take all the spead control humps off our roads to fill in the holes !. ispend as much time looking at humps as i do looking out for people.! further,putting all signs together in one place at a junction is nonsence. how can a driver take all that in, travelling safely at 30 mph,or even 20mph.? spread it out back down the road, so that he can take in important information and react possitively to it. motorways have got it almost right.

Posted by Brian Turner, 23rd August 2006 4:55pm

drivers in this country are simply being bled dry for the right to travel and conduct business speed camera partnerships are a revenue raising organisation
a form of tax
we all put up with the goverment abusing its citizens in the name of saftey
if we all brought the roads to a halt once in a while would the fat ministers take notice or will they continue to treat drivers like sheep
3 million a year for speeding fines is the declared target
30 million drivers in the uk
soon no one will drive ......

Posted by Gerald Meek, 23rd August 2006 5:25pm

As an Ambulance driver, on the emergency vehicles i find that many motorists do park in the most inconvenient places, this to me is inconsiderate parking by inconsiderate drivers. it does cause a problem for the emergency vehicles when drivers park their vehicles incorrectly. i had to go to a emergency in a residantual area and cars were parked both sides of a narrow road which meant that i could not get to the location i/we tried to contact some people who lived in those houses and no one would move the vehicles so i contacted control and they sent the police round who placed notices on all the vehicles warning them of their inconsiderate parking and informed me to continue were i took off most of the door mirrors and they could not complain to anyone.

Regards
Ken

Posted by Kenneth Woodward, 23rd August 2006 5:27pm

Parking is not a crime but is a very good source of revenue for the local council - as if they dont get enough money from us - but what do they spend the money on ?

Posted by Mike Sherriff, 23rd August 2006 5:28pm

As always joe public is a push over for Local Authorities to use as a cash cow in any way they see fit. As a motorist we are all absolute sitting ducks for any number of revenue raising exercises. If public transport was what it ought to be, reliable, clean, affordable and importantly convenient to peoples requirements then I am certain far more people would use it. But that is far to simplistic an aurgument for our "leaders". Far better to fulfill thier private ambitions via the public purse. Parking is all about revenue raising, simple as that!!

Posted by Neil Sykes, 23rd August 2006 5:33pm

Is everyone aware of the difference between Traffic Wardens and Parking Attendants I wonder? TW's are trained and 'badged' by the police and are increasingly rare. PA's are council employees. The most important difference is that due to their higher level of training TW's HAVE DISCRETION.

Posted by Malcolm Bell, 23rd August 2006 5:35pm

This comment has been removed as it was found to be in breach of our Blog Policies.

Sorry I appear to have finger trouble. To continue with my post TW's have discretion so can 'turn a blind eye' if for example a delivery vehicle is carrying out it's normal and probably regular delivery to a shop for example. PA's have no such discretion so just slap tickets on any vehicle they find parked illegally. This is why we hear stories of funeral vehicles, wedding cars etc being given tickets. The Traffic Warden will have a badge with the name of the local police force displayed. The Parking Attendant will not. The Warden may be reasoned with - but with Parking Attendants forget it!

Posted by Malcolm Bell, 23rd August 2006 5:42pm

This comment has been removed as it was found to be in breach of our Blog Policies.

What I find intriuging is that yellow lines were put there " for safety reason", so there was no blockage or interference to vehichles. So then they give cards to disabled (some of them are) and let them park there for two hours...thus getting in the bloody way.
Of COURSE the police can park across the pavement, they are in uniform and give themslves permission to park anywhere, same as they can use their mobile phones and transcievers while driving..don't say they don't I see it all then time.

Posted by Graham Barnard, 23rd August 2006 5:46pm

What annoys me most about parking on double yellow lines are the number of drivers whose cars are displaying blue disabled badges yet when they get out have obviously nothing wrong with them, plus they don't have a disabled passenger. those badges should only apply when the driver is the disabled person who need to park near a shop,etc. When the disabled person is driven what is to stop him/she being dropped off and the car parked in a car park and picked up afterwards.

Before anyone says I am biassed against the
disabled I most certainly am not as I am also disabled and have been for almost ten years. I just don't agree with the disabled badge being taken advantage of by the ignorant.

Posted by Bob Vandepeer, 23rd August 2006 5:48pm

If I park my car for a just a few minutes where parking is prohibited , I can get clamped.
If its ok for my clamped car to remain there for several hours until I pay the fee Why was it wrong to park there in the first place ?

Posted by Roger Henthorn, 23rd August 2006 5:48pm

I pay my road tax. I can park my car anywhere outside the town centre as long as it doesn't obstruct traffic or block people drives.

Why should as soon as I enter the town centre should I have to pay to park on the roadside?
What is so different about the town centre? I've paid my road tax, so I should be able to use any road in the same way.

Its exactly the same as congestion charging. How dare they charge you extra to visit another part of the road network.

Posted by Andrew, 23rd August 2006 5:50pm

I live in an area where you have to have parking permits. Every evening everyone is fighting for the same spaces as there isn't enough for the neibourhood. What makes me so cross is that right in the middle of my neibourhood there is a council car park for the enviromental agency which holds approx 35 cars but is totally empty between 5pm to 8.30am. Why can't the local council let cars with parking permits park there between those hours so to free up other spaces on the road. If for instance you then park outside those hours you get clamped. Would make so much sense, instead of having to park on single yellow lines and then have to move your car before the dreaded traffic warden comes round!

Posted by James Harmer, 23rd August 2006 5:53pm

I agree that parking restrictions should be used to help with traffic flow and safety issues and that contravention of reasonable parking restrictions should be subject to a penalty. But this, along with several other road traffic offences, should NEVER be classed as a crime. We all know what we would accept as criminal behaviour - e,g, causing an accident through drunk driving - but parking offences and other minor traffic infringements should not qualify.

Posted by John Sykes, 23rd August 2006 6:12pm

As a disabled person I am disgusted by the number of people who now park on the pavement. I very often use a disabled scooter and find I often have to backtrack to a point where I can get off the pavement and on to the road to get by the illegally parked car. By doing this I myself then fall foul of the law as my scooter is not road legal. I have complained to my local police force(Inverclyde), but nothing is ever done. Not only is this practise a danger to myself, but also putting in danger the lives of children in prams.
On the subject of yellow lines, yes, there are too many and they are policed too vigourously as they should be, but only where they are painted for a sensible reason.

Posted by John Irving, 23rd August 2006 6:17pm

As motorists we are one of the most highly taxed groups in this country either
by statute or by stealth, most councils raise vast amounts of money by parking
enforcement and strategically placed speed cameras,because these systems
especially parking enforcement rely on a certain amount of offences to pay for
their upkeep, with this in mind I will not go anywhere were parking is a problem
unless it is absolutely unavoidable and if you take my advise you will all do the same, there is generally somewhere cheaper or free if you shop around, perhaps if enough motorists boycott these places the message may get across.
The only way to deal with parking is to make it unprofitable. The only way to make sure it gets worse is to keep putting your hard earned cash into those council machines

Posted by Malcolm Clements, 23rd August 2006 6:24pm

In relation to Police parking, it is not a case of being in uniform and giving myself pemission to park anywhere, I have a exemption in law for parking restrictions.

That said, if my car is on yellow lines, then there is a good reason for it being there, I am likely to be dealing with a member of the public who needs my urgent assistance. If it's not urgent, I won't be parked on yellows.

In relation to using 'transceivers' again it is not illegal. If it were, CBs would be illegal. However, if you ever spot a Police driver using a mobile without a handsfree, please feel free to make a complaint to the local station.

Posted by Old Bill, 23rd August 2006 6:31pm

When are they going to make it a bike friendly country? So many Towns don't have any friendly traffic lights with space for cyclists at the front of the queue
Or make cycle tracks that actually go somewhere.
When there is an alternative to cars there won't be so many on the roads making it bterre for all

Posted by Anne Rowland, 23rd August 2006 6:32pm

only this saturday i was parked outside my sisters house visiting her in one of the two parking spaces she is allocated. As i came out of my sisters house a good old jobs worth traffic warden was busy putting a ticket on my car because i never had a residential parking permit on my car my sister tried to explain that i was visiting her and using one of her allocated spaces but to no avail i'm just writing this to see what other people think of my situation thanks ed

Posted by David Edwards, 23rd August 2006 6:33pm

This comment has been removed as it was found to be in breach of our Blog Policies.

In the town where I work there are 4 car park which sit empty most of the week because the charge to park there for the whole working day is excessive. Instead everyone parks on the yellow lines in front of people houses which annoys the residents. Then at 11am everyone rushes to their cars because for 1 hour you can not park on the yellow line. Everyone has to pay for one hours parking in the car park and then rush out of work again at 12 o'clock and fight to get a space back on the yellow lines. Where is the sense in it? I would happily pay a reasonable price to park all day and no have the worry of getting caught up at work and being late to move the car and get a ticket. The borough with this insanity is LBHarrow.

Posted by Helen Duffy, 23rd August 2006 6:45pm

Nail on the head .....when the issue changed and became decriminalised it is now a stealth Tax .........another one !!!

Posted by David Fletcher, 23rd August 2006 6:49pm

I believe if you park on a double yellow-the usual fine should apply. However...if you park in a designated parking bay and your ticket runs out you should only be fined say double your outstanding time. I believe there should be a sliding scale for those of us who truely try.
Blanketing everyone with the same fine is stupid. You might as well park in the way of an ambulance or fire engine!!!

Posted by Stevew, 23rd August 2006 6:56pm

I drive through Longsight (Manchester) on the A6 every morning between 8 and 8:30am, and at night between 17;45 and 18:15. At no time do we ever see a warden and at night there are cars and vans parked down both sides, restricting the thoroughfare to one lane in each direction. Are Manchester interested in keeping access open? I don't think so. There is a chance for them to make a few bob but it's easier prowling round the meters in the city catching the unfortunate souls who get back 5 mins late.

Posted by John Bodicoat, 23rd August 2006 7:00pm

Glasgow used to be a fairly car tolerant city, this however has all changed over the years and culminating recently in large areas of roads where road side parking used to be free now having to be paid for, funily enough it allways seems to be right out side the shops were you want to stop for your paper etc on the way to work. What really annoys me though is that it even applies in areas were the parking is in lay-by style areas to the side of the main road........money grabbing or what.

Posted by Peter Smith, 23rd August 2006 7:09pm

Got my first ticket the other week for not parking within the correct confines of the space. I'd parked between two cars and a) never noticed the markings b) didn't realise this was a ticketable offence.

Lesson learned though and Edinburgh �30 better off. Be careful how you park!

Posted by Billy Steele, 23rd August 2006 7:20pm

Being a motor vehicle owner, it is increasingly evident that the government and some of these local traffic enforcement agencies are using these double yellow lines as another stealth tax on the ever unsuspecting motorist. First it was the speed camera popping up in areas which had no history of being an accident hot spot, to the next new menace "double yellow line syndrome". The opportunity to place a double yellow line on any road where the motorist has a need to park their vehicle. Working in the City of Birmingham this is becoming more and more of a nightmare as the motorist struggles to park on what were once easily accessible roads. The government are using a poor public transport service as a way to penalise the motorist.

Posted by Shaun Bedward, 23rd August 2006 7:25pm

please see
www.parking-appeals.gov.uk

Posted by Lawrence J Wright, 23rd August 2006 7:27pm

Why is it that during the so called winter period (usually 30th Sept to Easter), you can park on double yellow lines along the sea front at many resorts (Skegness comes to mind).
However, as soon as people really want to be at the seaside then these exemptions do not apply. Can somebody explain just what has changed ? If I am not causing a problem in the winter, why am I suddenly causing one in the summer ?

Posted by Daid Hills, 23rd August 2006 7:31pm

Also if you are parked in a bay where there are broken lines at either end.

Be aware that if there is one broken line at one end and two broken lines at the other the parking bay under the Road Traffic act is illegal! They must have the same lines at either end of the bay. Take a picture to prove it and challenge the ticket.

Its the same with a yellow line if the line is broken at any part between the ends its illegal, again, take a piccy and fight the fine!

Cheers

Posted by Craig Humphreys, 23rd August 2006 7:36pm

I live in the Village where the Prime Minister & The President of the U S A had dinner last year & whilst this was going on nobody dare Park incorrectly, even the most menial offence was emmediately stamped on but since that time people park there Cars on Yellow lines on Pavements, on Zig Zag lines at the only Zebra Crossing & illegally park in the only two Disabled spaces on the High Street with complete immunity now that the Traffic Wardens have been disbanded which leaves it up to the Local Police if you can find one to complain to without it taking several phone calls to Durham Police Headquarters & the last time I did that it took three days only to be told that as long as someone (one person) could get past it was O K. What about Mothers with Buggies or the Disabled maybe in a Wheelchair. Oh dear maybe they don't count or should they invite the President or the P M along to make sure the Highway Code or the Laws of the land are upheld.

Posted by Alan Hardwick, 23rd August 2006 7:38pm

Prior to councils being responsible for parking enforcement, here in Chatham Kent the High Street linking Chatham to Rochester was in one area of about 250 yards double yellow lined. As soon as the Council took over enforcement of the rules, hey presto the double lines had been removed and parking meters installed! How can a road previously regarded as too narrow and dangerous to allow parking become overnight a safe area to park? It just confirms that Councils are applying the rules to increase revenue, a bit like Gordon Brown and his stealth taxes.
OK it is against the law to park on double lines but our local authority takes delight in sending out teams of attendants before 7am on a Sunday morning to issue parking tickets. Once again it is only done to increase revenues and causes an enormous amount of ill feeling and face it there is just not enough space for everyone to park - at least when the police enforced the rules a certain amount of common sense prevailed.

Posted by Brian Hext, 23rd August 2006 7:46pm

In 1689 an act of parliment was passed. this act was really important as we had just been through a constitutional nightmare. With two English civil wars that encompased all the people living onthese islands. The act was aclled the act of settlement. This act laid downthe privlidgies and duties of the monarch.
the powers and responsibilities of the parliment. and the rights andresponsibilities of the people. The bill of rights attachet to the act states in clause 12 that no person shall suffer confiscation, penalties or have a fine imposed with out first having been found guilty of an offence in a court of law!
I believe that any one attempting to impose any of these penalties is in breach of this act and should be reported to the magistrates to answer charges. I have used this as a defence against a camera speeding penalty notice and the fixed penelty was withdrawen as ' not in the public interest'
Un fortunatly I did not pursue the person issuing the fixwe penalty as like most people I just want to be left alone. Perhaps someone out there might like to take up thr challange and bring charges before the local magistrates.
Before the local bin man issues them with a fixed penalty for puting the 'wrong type' of rubbish in their bin!

Posted by William Crawford, 23rd August 2006 7:51pm

Our local council used to allow you to park on a Saturday for free in their car park, which was great as it was only a short walk into Ormskirk town centre with the market available on Saturdays - then all of a sudden they made it a "Pay & Display", that first Saturday I parked as normal and when I returned to my car (in less than an hour) it had a ticket on it. Oooops �30 fine and every car in the carpark also had a ticket on it, what a revenue day that was for the council. I asked the young lady giving out these tickets what was going on as I didn't know it had changed, she pointed out small signs that used to also be blue stating "Council Car Park" but now stated "Pay & Display", and if I didn't pay the ticket within 30 days the fine doubled, needless to say I paid the fine and no longer shop in Ormskirk, I use Skelmersdale as the parking is free. I know lots of other people who also do the same, and most people veto the council car park - so know it lies empty on Saturdays, and the local shops and market lose revenue. where is the sense in this? Apart from the initial mass income from the fines they are getting nothing from people parking and shops are shutting so they are losing rent from them!!

Posted by Jan Mcconkey, 23rd August 2006 8:26pm

One of the biggest problems for free flowing traffic is bus lane. They steal 50% of what is left of the road after the cycle track has been laid, and give its use to private bus companies, or private hire vehicles (taxis).
I agree with bus lanes where they are really necessary, during the rush hour, but how can you justify a 24 hour bus lane, when only 3 buses per hour use it, and none during the night.
It's HIGHWAY robbery. Less bus lanes would mean more FREE parking space.

Posted by Roger Peek, 23rd August 2006 8:32pm

what about red routes and bus lanes supposedly taboo to cars,consistently
blocked by thoughtless drivers causing even more congestion. Is there not a specification regarding the width required for the lines to be legal? I thought they had to be at least 4" wide!

Posted by Brian Shopland, 23rd August 2006 8:44pm

It used to be that if you bought a ticket to put in your windscreen in a car park and you didn't use up the allotted time, you would give the ticket to someone else. Not any more. My local car park now has me entering my VRN which is printed on the ticket. So if I buy two hours worth of parking and only use one, who's gaining?

Local authorities are not allowed to make a profit, so where's the money going?

Posted by Russ Fletcher, 23rd August 2006 8:47pm

Blackpool is a no go area as far as parking is concerned SO VISITORS BEWARE if you don't want your trip to Blackpool to cost you a fortune in fines. Everywhere you go it is yellow lines, restricted parking, metered parking residents parking or NO PARKING. As a DISABLED DRIVER I was fined �30 for a 25 minute stay in a motorcyclists bay in the centre of town. The council had mucked about so much with the parking in Blackpool that the place that once was a disabled bay had been turned into a bay for BIG BUTCH MOTORCYCLISTS. I parked there without double checking the writing on the road. Within 15 minutes a KIND HEARTED TRAFFIC WARDEN had given me a ticket obviously noting that I was disabled and how long I had been parked by the clock on my dash. I appealed to the council, acknowledging that I had done wrong, but with no obvious intent on infringinging the parking rules. The appeal was rejected and I was told in no uncertain terms that I should have seen the writing on the floor. I have been driving 42 years and have NEVER BEFORE HAD A PARKING TICKET OR ANYTHING. As you say the councils are all out to make money and no where quite so blatant as BLACKPOOL.

Posted by Charlotte Hale, 23rd August 2006 8:52pm

I agree with the contributor who commented about the parking on corners being a danger - someone pulled out of a side road and smashed into my car as they couldn't see me coming. Is it illegal to park within a certain distance of a corner?
In Bristol we need the yellow lines on the main routes to keep the traffic flowing at peak times and it really annoys me when delivery vehicles and inconsiderate people park there at those times, thus causing nightmarish traffic jams - traffic in Bristol is bad enough at the best of times without these selfish idiots causing added mayhem then!

Posted by Helen Wallbridge, 23rd August 2006 9:13pm

I am a disabled driver and wheelchair user. Until recently I used to park in the car park at Cromer (Norfolk) and was quite happy to trundle round town in my powered chair. That is until NNDC decided that everyone should be charged for parking in their off street car parks. THEN THEY PUT THE CHARGES UP!!!

Now I park on double yellow lines for the designated time, between two areas which are marked for 1 hour stay.

If I was not in a possition to use a powered chair or wheel myself around in a manual chair, I would not appreciate being dumped in the centre of town while my husband and carer went to park the car in a car park.

I agree that most people and that includes disabled drivers do park very badly, especially across dropped kerbs. How stupid it that for a disabled driver to do that!!

With regard to the Blue Badge, the Police and Traffic Wardens have the authority to ask to see the badge and check if the relevant person is using it. i.e. by the picture if necessary.

I have to use a car as I live in a small village, but although it does have busses running through it from time to time, they are not accessible to wheelchair users.

One example of that, is the Bus that runs along the coast road to Hunstanton. The outward journey is an accessible bus, but strangely enough the homward journey does not have an accessible bus.

Posted by Ann Argent, 23rd August 2006 9:13pm

While we are on the subject of double yellow lines and pther painted nonsence on the public highway how many years have buses and cyclists traveled up and down the roads of Englang without the the local concils marking the road with Green / Red / Yellow tarmac has the world gone mad or have the councils found no other way to spend the exra revenue they are obtaining through fines for parking and speeding !!

Posted by Simon Beswick, 23rd August 2006 9:14pm

The whole thing about parking is most unreasonable now. The thing is if laws and regulations appear unfair then people break them anyway, although in the case of city councils and 'illegal parking' they benefit from it obviously. Its got out of hand and is should be a Government department or agency that deals with placing yellow lines, or at least passes council yellow lining requests or otherwise, as we are all suffering now for the money making antics of these councils.

I got a ticket most recently for parking on a yellow line while I went for a 'cheap' lunch as there appeared to be no other parking spaces. The cheap lunch turned into a very expensive lunch as I got a �30 ticket. I sent a cheque once I eventually found the parking ticket, but as I post-dated it by a week, Birmingham city council returned my cheque without banking it, saying they do not accept post dated cheques (as specified on the reverse of the ticket - which I couldn't find until too late). There letter stated that I now owed �60. Is this fair and reasonable? Of course not. Its poposterous.

I also got a ticket on the day I was helping to move my wife out of her flat in Newcastle (we live apart). It was a memorable day indeed - it was now the notorious day of the London bombings - 7/7. While glued to the TV for obvious reasons, I foolishly left it a little late going to the car. By the time I got down to the car, a traffic warden had stuck a ticket on it. I was incensed, not only because I thought I had not parked illegally, but also it seemed totally petty and inappropriate to be slapping tickets on cars when one's mind was on the terrible happenings of that morning. I thought I was safely parked anyway, as I was in a parking bay with a hood over the meter. Apparently this doesn't mean that no charges apply, it means that you can't park there. It was not made clear. I protested and sent pictures of the bay and the signs there, to no avail. I refused to pay out of principle, plus by this time it was getting quit expensive and not very affordable. It went to court. The court date came up and I couldn't make it. The fine turned into something well over �100. I tried to complain and wrote a letter explaining the circumstances, but Newcastle city council weren't having any of it. There seems to be no heart left in such matters anymore. I thought they should be ashamed of themselves in the circumstances, but it is like talking to robots I'm afraid.

To end on a slightly higher note - a while ago I parked outside my wife's new flat. You need a parking permit here. By the time I got back down to the car - albeit around an hour later - a parking attendant had stuck a penalty notice on my car. My relative wrote a letter to the ticket issuer, explaining the circumstances, and it was resolved without need to pay the fine. This however, is not a typical happy ending when one is dealing with

Posted by Paul Heaney, 23rd August 2006 9:20pm

Talking of kind hearted traffic wardens, I once got a parking ticket for parking outside the house I live in - the one I pay a mortgage on - because there is only a 2 hour parking time in the street in which I live. When I tackled the local council I was told that just because I had bought a house in the street it did not mean that I was entitled to park in the said street. When asked where I could park my car I was told to try the car park half a mile away. The said car park is not only half a mile away but is locked up at 7pm until 9 am but its free for all who choose to use it.

Posted by Elaine Adams, 23rd August 2006 9:25pm

Where I live the council run both Car Parks and Parking Attendents so they get the best of both worlds add yellow paint to the road dive the motorist into the Car Parks at �1:60 per hour or part of. Park on Yellow line and get a fine.
The Motorist is in a no win situation

Posted by Phil Pollington, 23rd August 2006 9:27pm

Lets talk 'selfish parkers' and why TW's and PA's are powerless to ticket them. Selfish in that they double park at one end of a T-shaped back-street (which, is also blocked at the other two entrances by 2 working backstreet garages who use the backstreet closest to them as a 'waiting area' for cars awaiting attention (some of which can wait for days....) - yet, the selfish parkers at the other end of the backstreet will double park completely blocking any entrance or exit for their neighbours - and why do they do this? Simple - they have an ongong vendetta with each other - so we all have to suffer. I've been informed that only the Police have the power to deal with this problem.....but how long would we have to wait for any Police action should another emergency vehicle, say, a Fire Engine....need access to the backstreet ? Its a frightening though, ones life on the line and their being blocked accesses due to pettiness from neighbours, and overspill parked cars from backstreet garages.

Posted by Juliette Dalton, 23rd August 2006 9:28pm

Let's be honest, parking fines are in the main nothing to do with improving trafic flow, in many instances quiite the reverse. Why clamp a car ? It locks it in place far longer and disrupts traffic flow and if parked on a meter prevents other mororisrs from using it. Side roads in many parts of London have virtually no traffic flow at all, however to inrease their revenue yellow lines are painted by the local council to take more money from the poor beleagured motorist.

Posted by Stan Scott, 23rd August 2006 9:53pm

Let me start by saying, �15 Fred? You got off lightly mate, it's �30 or �60 here in and around Newcastle upon tyne depending on where you get done!
I personally always try to avoid parking anywhere where there is a charge unless absolutely necessary and even if it is i will make sure it is a privatley owned car park as i just feel that why should we have to pay councils to use the roads twice over as we already shell out for road tax! (there is still the areas where they allow up to 1hour with no return within 1-2hrs but even they are becoming increasingly scarce)
In North Shields for example and parts of the city, the streets used to have such an enforcement, but now these greedy councils have installed parking meters and are charging anywhere in the region of 50p a hour to �1-20! And if you do not obey then there is a charge of 30 - 60 pounds! There is a waste area in North Shields which people made into a sort of make shift car park where they would park their cars, it was so popular that it was always full during the day, after a couple of years they council of North Tyneside promptly fenced it off and these parking meters started to sprout up all over the place without so much as a warning except a small spread in the local free press of which practically know one gets anymore as not enough paper boys to deliver them!
At least if the car park is private, then atleast there is a arguement to pay for you parking but as it is the council then why should we! Except to avoid a parking fine! At the end of the day they recieve a % of your road tax to pay for the roads maintenance etc!
Sorry this is so long just had to be said!

Posted by Richard Sloway, 23rd August 2006 10:10pm

I just thought that i would add my tuppence worth here, where i stayed a few years ago there was a case in court where the occupier of a vehicle was fined for parking on double yellows. the lines he was parked on had not been maintained and there was breaks in the yellow line, he managed to get off with it. i dont know if this would work all the time but if i have to park on them i look for un-maintained ones.

Posted by Cal C, 23rd August 2006 10:10pm

I am a traffic Warden down south we were told at the beginning of August that we may be losing our jobs because our lines are being de-criminalised heaven help the poor motorist when the private companies take over ! !. At least we have common sense. The last thing we want to do is issue tickets, all that does cause the obstruction to stay, we would rather find the driver, give him a ********* and send him one his way, at least traffic can move freely again.

Posted by Peter Chapman, 23rd August 2006 10:14pm

in answer to vandameers disabled badge gripe,my wife and myself both are disabled and have a blue badge,i do not look disabled but doctors and examiners have deemed me disabled,these people are a lot more qualified on who is disabled and thankfully not vandameer who sounds like a person who has tried to obtain the blue badge and has been refused,sour grapes methinks

Posted by L Duff, 23rd August 2006 10:15pm

i live in newcastle upon tyne where we have bus lanes down the centre or the road, also we have a motorway where the slip road comes in on to the outside lanes (some people call it the fast lane but it is the same speed limit), have the city planners gone mad in our city!! i think there have.

Posted by Gordon Myers, 23rd August 2006 10:16pm

Who else finds Controlled Parking Zones annoying? Firstly if you miss seeing the sign when you enter the area, you would not know that there is one in force.

Think logically about most CPZs. They are designed to "protect" parking spaces outside your property during the day - when the majority of people are out at work. In the evening when you return home, and want to park your car - there are no parking restrictions!!

I am waiting for a local council to allow parking in the road, EXCEPT between midnight and 6am !

Posted by Martin Rosen, 23rd August 2006 10:18pm

Ok.......
i well parking fines are needed in some places a prime example is oxford city, if you in some parts you have a permit to park on the lines, if not you will get a ticket, this allows local residents to have parking great. I have to put up with a circa 35seater bussparked oposite my house due to one of my fantastic neighbours, and the council will do nothing about that and it makes the road unsafe as itsa few yrads froma junction, you are unable to see out the junction to pull onto the road since the bus slocks your vision :/

However , putting yellows everywhereso you have to pay to use the car park is unfair:/

and as for the guy who complained he can't get his scooter through on the pavement when cars are parked on it.
I dont agree cars should be parked on the pavement at all,but as my mother is disabled i also know that you should not be using your electric scooter on the pavement, the number of time inconsiderate "disabled"people have nearly sent me head over heels screaming down the pavement like they own it because they have an orange badge :/ i have even hadmy foot run over by one.

Posted by Andrew Daniels, 23rd August 2006 10:19pm

I am a blue badge holder, and can use my badge to allow me to park on double yellow lines with impunity for up to 3 hours. The blue badge rules state that I shouldn't cause obstruction, therefore can I conclude that anyone parking on double yellow lines is generally not causing an obstruction? Therefore there should be no offence committed when motorists park there. If causing an obstruction, motorists will be charged with that offence.

Posted by Anne Brodie, 23rd August 2006 10:22pm

No matter what part that you people live in the country, how many in your area take notice of double yellow lines. In my area of Blackwood and its surrounding area of south Wales, about 95% of motorists dont take any notice of these lines. The local council and police might as well forget them as even the law dont bother to summonds people for parking on them. I have seen people parked on them, and the local law just cruise past them not bothering. Yet last week I seen a vehicle in the high street of Blackwood with a disabled parking badge in the window, and a traffic warden was placing a parking ticket on the window of this vehicle. Perhaps the local council is running out of money. In this area they charge in their car parks, but in other areas of the borough, they dont charge.

Posted by Richarrd Morgan, 23rd August 2006 10:24pm

I have to disagree with the poster who stated that disabled passengers should be dropped off and the abled bodied driver go and park in a car park. My mother is disabled through a car accident (she can just able walk, but not very far) and if I were to do as the gentlemen suggested, it would cause more congestion, as I would have to park the car up, get her walking sticks/zimmer frame, help her out of the vehicle, get back in the car and drive off. By the time I found a "proper parking space" and returned to where I dropped her off, she'd be in agony and I would need to return to my car and go through the process of getting her back in the car.

Chorley Council (Lancashire) have recently changed a street parking space to a maximum limit of 1/2 hour. This space is directly outside the dentist on St Georges Road. The Parking Warden could see we had "an out of town blue badge" but waited until we were walking out of the dentist before he started to "book" me (I was apparently 5 mins over the alloted time), whilst stating is this your car madam. Ironically, if I would have been parked a cars length back, I would have been fine for 2 hours, so I wasn't posing a congestion risk - it was a revenue risk. I tried to appeal, but was basically told to get lost.

I have heard that Parking Attendants get commission - not sure how true this is. Can anybody qualify this rumour....?

Posted by Dee Cee, 23rd August 2006 10:35pm

In the area where I live there were three main places for parking, non busy streets, where people parked and walked to get a train, go to work or use the gym, the traffic on these roads are minimal all day long, the local council saw that these streets were packed with cars and over one year, along came yellow lines and meters, why? to make money. Once there were twenty to thirty cars on these roads, now there is one or two, and as soon as they go past the meter time, along comes two wardens, one with a ticket and a camera, the other with a clamp notice and two minutes later along comes the tow truck, the activities around here with wardens are criminal not to mention the council. Double red or yellow lines, around the city or busy main roads I understand, yellow lines on back streets, that no one use, is council criminal money making.

Posted by Patrick Samuels, 23rd August 2006 10:39pm

i agree local councils love this law, they charge here at supermarkets in town, the supermarkets dont agree but cant fight it so what chance do we have! and the wardens actually wait to see if people come back to there cars in time! the main streets of our holiday town can only be parked on for two hours which is not even enough for a meal and if people come for the day they have to pay a fortune in the car parks, this is putting people off coming to a town by the sea that has relied on visitors for most of its life!

Posted by M Htn, 23rd August 2006 10:46pm

Very little of the issues relating to parking enforcement has anything to do with safety and or traffic flow now. The system is realy about local authorities stealing money from the motorist who has already paid their taxes that give them the legal rights to drive on, and park on the highways. We are nothing more than a money making target for local fund raisng to reduce the need for national governent to cough up support grants. Yet another form of legalized theft. If national government stopped sending so much of our hard earned cash abroad and stopped fighting wars on behalf of Bush, then we would all be better of, including our troops.

Posted by William Dean, 23rd August 2006 10:52pm

As Motorists are now a major taxpayer in this country,the last figures quoted in the media being �44 billion a year from ALL sources of motoring and less than �3 Billion spent on roads.It is time motorists demanded a better deal.

1/ Fast repair work (24 hours)on major bottlenecks.A special grant provided for extra staff required. Road Contractors must guarantee their work as too many repairs are needed soon after a new road is opened.Why should the tax payer pay for shoddy work?Of course the specifications for a new road should be right in the first place. Road Inspectors should do their job properly.
2/ Each County Council has a special team of "Road Tuners" to ensure that all speed restrictions are adjusted to the area,all unneeded road furniture be removed or adjusted if blocked by trees or blocking drivers views at junctions.All traffic lights reviewed for removal or adjustment.(It is suprising in some places how fast traffic flows when traffic lights are not working)
The whole idea of this team is to make sense of the idea of making good road progress.
3/ All Bus stops and road islands and crossings be checked to see if the bus stops all the traffic as it picks up passengers close to these refuges.Apparently a bus stop may be painted within the zig zag area at controlled crossings legally.A very silly idea considering why the zig zags were put there in the first place. All bus lanes are for peak periods only where possible.
4/ Bicycles should get back on the road and pay to do so.This would a/Make the motorists feel better about the holdups that are caused by bicycles taking up road space, and b/The cyclists will feel they have a paid right to be on the road in the first place. This would bring in another tax windfall for Gordon if operated on a simple once a year payment �10 - �20 Admin kept to a minimum like topping up a mobile. The danger from pavement cyclists is getting greater by the month and young children or infirm people will certainly be in harms way when they should be safer.
5/ There should be a dedicated Highway patrol with police powers who actually stop and put tickets on cars that are causing obstructions on double yellows or pavements.The Traffic Warden/Parking attendants must be taken off the bonus scheme that keeps them from patrolling outside town centres because it is less lucrative for them.
6/ Local & County Councils should be taken to court if their "New" traffic schemes cause more polution than their old ones.If it was an oil spill the company would be sued.Traffic is here to stay although an intregated efficient low cost transport policy would and should be set up to encourage
motorists off the road.This certainly applies to School traffic that should have bus services dedicated to get rid of Chelsea Tractors and all the cars that now clog the system driven by concerned parents.
7/ This could happen if people like our old farmer friend who came out of the Welsh hills to protest at the price of petrol and derv were to organise all the (Is it millions?)of motorists now suffering.That worried the Govrnment at the time didn't it? Remember we are the Golden Geese, �41 billion of our money is diverted and not all on the NHS as Blair will say but on, well you know what they are as there are so many.

8/ It won't happen though will it?

Posted by John Thorpe, 23rd August 2006 10:53pm

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