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Are we really going to make a difference? Fuel Prices are are going up because of long-running tensions in the Middle East. It seems pointless to me as I have a Saudi husband...

NO GOOD AT WEEKENDS. HIT OIL REFINERY AND PETROL STATIONS MID WEEK. THE GOVERMENT MUST TAKE NOTE IF THE WHOLE COUNTRY STANDS UP TO BE COUNTED

As most have pointed out, the problems lie with the (as always) volatile Middle East and the rip off tax of the Labour Government, plus hiding behind the 'Green' banner of we should all be using public transport, because we all live in London with the tube and buses - NOT! Wasn't it the Government that introduced legislation to fit Catalysts to cars as it was supposed to make them cleaner? Well, I now have a Cat equipped car but apparently that's still not good enough and I should be taxed off the road.

Listen Mr Brown et all; buses & trains are part of the infrastructure, not a replacement. Try living in a rural county, with an employer who expects you to be flexible in the hours you work and then public transport is NOT AN OPTION. Even if I could use public transport, I will still need to purchase a car for other transportation uses, so in effect I double my expenses. Thanks, but I'll stick to my car.

Subject: Fuel injustice

I have become aware of the fact that we pay VAT on fuel duty. Is this the norm throughout the EEC or is it just an unchallenged anomaly in the British system. If the Government were to charge VAT on the fuel element of petrol or diesel, it would make a considerable cost saving to road users. The fact that we pay only 5% VAT on domestic gas indicates the unfairness of fuel taxation.
Has anybody ever thought of highlighting this situation with the authorities in order to affect change in fuel cost?

I think it's high time we all stood up for ourselves in this country. we are taxed at every level. petrol prices are killing uk coach and lorry firms not to mention Jo public. European trucks fill up at Calais and come over to the uk without paying tax or fuel for their journeys, they work over here and head home when low. when I go over the coast of fuel is cheaper but we pay road tolls and tax in most european countrys, the same should apply here and revenue taken should be put to ease fuel cost here. one ferry the other evening had 77 european trucks coming off it with just 3 from the uk. help each other stand up and be counted.

In France the entire nation is quite capable of getting up (or not getting up :) ) and having a national strike, that is whats required here.
for starters its hard to hit one fuel manufacturer as they have so many different brands under one company.
so say...esso would probably ship a load of fuel cheap (ish) to asda and get it sold that way

the nation needs to unite and strike just one day would be enough to cause a stir, it would hit international headlines.

and will someone tell the government that charging us more to drive wont save the environment, it just makes the nation's people poorer and less productive, with no enthusiasm for their work.

It seems to me that the real price of fuel isn't all that bad. The taxation applied by the lunatic labour party on the other hand, seems designed to cripple British industry. Come on people, the protest needs to be at the ballot box and at the houses of parliment. Tell your M.P.in writing that he will never see another vote from you or your family if he doesn't do something about taxation. And stand over your word, remember these leechs are only in power because you voted for them. They are supposed to work for you not the other way round.

the cost of the uk's interferrance in the middle east is partly being paid for by the motorist by taxation on fuel here.
what benefits do we see on our roads for all the extra we've been paying over the years?
exactly - higher fuel prices do nothing to save the environment - the motorist contribution to environmental damage is so minimal compared to industrial damage.
and have you ever been to a marina and seen how much is spent on fuel just by people enjoying a bit of (luxury / expensive) leisure time?
welcome to rip off britain - too much apathy is why the country is the way it is.
if everyone boycots BP outlets continuously until the price of fuel is reduced to 60p per litre that should have some impact without leaving us stranded in remote areas like the stikes have done in the past.

what a lot of predictable nonsense.

PETROL IS CHEAP!!!!

your average family car will provide round the clock transport at a cost of less than 10P PER MILE. THAT IS CHEAP

if thats to expensive, convert to lpg, search on this site, its around 45-50 PENCE PER LITRE. i run a large 3.2l car around town for 8p per mile.

truck and loryy drivers, if the frence and others can fill up in france and work in the uk, why dont you stop moaning and go and fill up in france and come back to do the work!! there is lots as the roads are full of trucks

What a load of codswallop from sean piatt.. all uk lorry drivers should go to france to fill up and stop moaning!!!
My dad is a truck driver, delivering stone in a 50-60 mile radius of the quarries of the peak district. How is it practical to drive to france to fill up.. a 400 mile round trip, the cost of the ferry.. and the simple fact that at the end of the trip, he would be out of fuel again.. DUH!! think before you post.. the world doesnt stop at the m25.
I think people would be happy to spend £1 a litre on petrol IF the money the government raised from it actually went back into the roads to improve them..
17 years ago at the the time the berlin wall came down, i drove around east germany, over potholled roads that really were terrible..
I can honestly say though, that they were better than some of the major A roads I've driven on in this country recently.

A really good xmas present this year for petrol protesters would be the new film "Crude Awakening" on DVD - just search for it on your favourite online DVD shop. This should explain the problems we are facing with regards to peak oil in easy to understand terms.

Perhaps then the fuel protester might decide to put their efforts into something more productive such as the Transition Town projects seen on transitionculture <dot> org.

In the long term, petrol prices will not be coming down, You are going to be forced to change your lifestyle to suit regardless of if you want to or not, due to peak oil production and anthropogenic climate change. Better to start badgering the government about rasing it's people's awareness to these very important issues than to waste time trying to persuade it to lower costs of petrol in the short term - something which it will not be able to sustain in the long term regardless of how much you may think that they are trying to do you over.

Thanks.

Rob.

In agreement with post 22.

Stop wasting time with this protest.

Put your energy into taking control of your lives by taking individual action to mitigate the effect of PEAK EVERYTHING on you and your families.

I am making the assumption here that you are intelligient people who can see beyond the next 5 minutes. Get informed. Do not follow the official line, there isn't one. Investigate.

Start investigating PEAK OIL and PEAK everything. There is a crisis but it's absolutely f**k all to do with this protest! Wake up, or are you actually waiting for Gordon to make a slip in his next speech and call you the 'sheeple'?

I wish, I truly wish that I didn't feel the need to write this, but you are heading down a blind alley, it would be wrong not to at least warn you all that the way we live is undergoing fundamental change. Take responsibility now.

The solution to high fuel prices is the find ways to use less. Oil will become ever more expensive and then unavailable, waiting until then to find ways to live without oil will be far harder than moving away from oil now.

All this talk about high tax and protest is seriously counter-productive. The absolute last thing we need to cheaper fuel and the increased reliance on oil it will bring. High tax is a good thing as it has provided the UK with a early warning of what is to come.

We all need to recognise that the future is one of less oil and find a way to live with that reality.

There is more oil left in the ground than we have actually used in the last 100 years. In fact several hundred years worth even allowing for increased use . We are all being brain washed in to parting with our hard earned cash with little or no resistance. Why are we allowing this . it's got to stop.

"There is more oil left in the ground than we have actually used in the last 100 years."

There is. And it is increasingly more energy intensive to extract and even more intensive to refine due to it's higher sulphur content.

We have had the sweet light crude. Whats left is going to cost more and take longer to bring to the markets - hence why peak oiil is a FLOW PROBLEM and not purely a depletion problem.

Imagine you have a million pound in the bank but can only with draw 20 pounds a day. This is great you think until the day comes where you actually require 25 pounds to sustain yourself. This is the situation we are in with the remaining oil.

A cursory glance at the miriad of sites explaining the problem would inform you of these things so... please feel free to go and read them.

Not only SHOULD refineries and petrol stations be targetted but ALL roads and town centers should be blocked allowing ONLY fire and ambulance vehicules allowed through and then only if an emergancy

"I read some of these posts and it's like the whole smoking issue, "It's pointless saying to a smoker that it's bad for them.."THEY KNOW ALREADY!!!", but try and help them see that there can be a life without them without the need to feel your missing out and people will change when they are ready."
OK yes I'm an ex smoker.... :-)"


Er, no. Say the price of producing tobacco was going up (which it will be due to the fact that it's a massively dependent of artificial pesticides (you guessed it , from oil, and fertiliser from gas). It's would be like a smoker protesting about the price of cigarettes going up and up to a group of people who have no direct control over the pricing of the comoddity. He refuses to quit smoking even though it's costing him more and more and then comes to the conclusion that everyone else in society should pay to keep him in his addiction to cigarettes by demanding a cut in taxes.

If your average motorist "knew already" about the full ramifications of peak oil they would certainly not be protesting about fuel pricingg and taxes. They would already know that it was an act of futility! they'd be looking at how to change their lives with much haste.


"Oh the poor tax payer" - yes indeed. The burden on the NHS thats paid for by the poor tax payer is increasing caused by the ever increasing number of cars on our roads and the damage that they do directly (traffic accidents) and indirectly (pollution). Yet when the people using the cars are asked to pay for their damage they are up in arms about it like a 10 year old obese child screaming at it's mother because she won't let it have another big mac and a chocolate milk shake! grow up!

ok, so i missed the bit about not doing it mid week. What is the point in Trans doing it on a weekend.

20 years ago I was totally unaware of any environmental issues, and would have happily carried on trying to live like everyone else. Then I started to discover the damage that humans are doing to the planet, and ever since have been finding out more and more problems we are causing. We are totally dependant on oil, not only for transport, but for almost everything our lives depend on. Agriculture that provides our food depends on oil for energy and fertiliser, and even the small things in life like Christmas decorations are made from plastics that come from oil. Not only is the rate that oil is burned having a disastrous effect on the climate, and on the ability of humans to survive on Earth, but the ever growing demand for oil means that we are starting to want use it at a faster rate than it can be extracted. Most of the easy to acquire oil has been used up, otherwise the oil companies wouldn't be starting to extract oil from tar sands in Alaska, a highly inefficient process, as well as environmentally damaging.

Even though I've been very aware of these problems for so long, it's hard for me to prepare to adapt my life to cope with it, and it's far easier for me to change the way I live than it is for most people. So it's no wonder most people are in denial, and can't (or are scared to) accept that their lives need to totally change in the next few years. Government, the media and big business haven't taken responsibility for making us all aware of what we need to do, so when it really sinks in it's going to be an even bigger shock and faster change will be needed.

I don't like paying well over £1 a litre for diesel. I currently live in a motorhome while I'm working on my plans to adapt to a sustainable life. We need to be using fossil fuels to create a new world where we can live with hugely reduced consumption of them, not burn them all up desperately trying to continue with our current lifestyle.

it is a big coincidence how fuel prices sudenly shot up when the govenment raised the legal age for smoking from 16 to 18 . they knew they would loose money from doing this so put up the price of fuel to gain the money back

We should all stop filling at one fuel supplier Bp, Esso or Shell at a time for a whole week or even a month, go for the big companies coppers and everyone could be involved. Having a government that wants you to work but have to travel by car to the work place as there is no Public transport that goes anywhere near and being penalised for not living in London.

re 43

Absolutely, we all have much more important issues to consider, protesting is simply a knee jerk reaction.

Actually waking up to the reality of our situation would help (hint hint google 'peak oil' then after a couple of months when the implications of that have started to sink in, truly sink in, then google 'peak everything')

It's the Matrix if that makes it easier to understand.

I heartily agree with most of what has been said. I might add that, as an OAP, the cost of diesel is beginning to bite hard. Living in a rural area obviously creates problems. I have changed my car to a lower CO2 rating/better mpg and have, in the past,purchased bio-diesel.The only garage I could find was in Diss. I used this fuel until the garage closed. Despite writing to a variety of fuel distributors I have had no satisfaction in obtaining another source of supply. My home is in East Beds and i would love to find a biofuel suplier near here.

Good luck on Saturday - remmber the old RAF motto: Nil illegitimus et carborundum (Don't let the b......s gring you down!!!!!

I have read all comments so far, and agree that there should be some sort of compromising between the use of oil products (Which include fuel, paints, plastics and all the other things that are made from oil) and our daily lives.

Ok, so local governments have started various recycling programs which could help reduce the amount of new plastics being processed, therefore reducing oil consumption, but unfortunately fuel is not recyclable.

There fore to reduce our oil demand further, new forms of power need to be developed and rolled out to the masses.
Car industry have been toying with electro / hybrid vehicles for many years, and I'm sure that one day, maybe in the next 10 / 20 years they will get the same performance out of such technology at a reasonable price.
I especially read with interest, articles on Biodiesel, which I believe is renewable, as it uses plant oils (PLease correct me if I'm wrong), but:
1. why is it not yet freely availiable?
2. Does it pollute like fossil fuels?
3. Do you get the same sort of performance from it?
4. Will the government tax the hell out of it, if it becomes more widely used?*

*This assumes that the government are taxing current fossil fuels in an attempt to deter people from using so much, as it causes pollution and is derived from a constrained resource.

Further comments concerning people use of vehicles and fuel.
As I say, I agree we should look at reducing our dependence on fossil fuels.
However, I use my car for more than traveling to and from a place of work.
I am currently an active musician outside working hours, so I need to be able to transport many items of equipment from venue to venue, Also transporting large items around (Say for home improvment purposes), so i don't think these would be easliy carried on public transport.
There is also the whole inconvenience of public transport.
Example - It currently takes me 3/4 hour to drive to work (On a good day).
If I took A bus, it would take 1hour and 20 minutes, and I would still have to walk 15 minutes to get to work.
If I took a train, I would need to either drive to the station, or catch a bus to the station, (15 Minutes) then wait for the train (Maybe 15 Minutes) then the journey by train (20 minutes), then a walk to work (20 Minutes).
Apart from the fact that It would take longer to get to and from work, it would cost alot more aswell. Cost of getting to the station, Cost of Parking a car, Cost of Train fare.
Plus, I understand that train fare are set to increase at the start of next year.


In essence, What I would like to see is this.

1. The government realise that they can't just keep on taxing the British citizen for every little thing, and that we put them in power for our benefit.
2. The wider availibility of alternative fuel sources, which would impact on the environment, so therefore they can't keep hiding behind the whole "green" issue.
I have my suspicions that these alternative fuel sources are out there, by the government are too pally with the oil companies to let them loose their monopoly.

Just a guess.

yes yes yes about time l don't care if have no petrol over christmas if gordon brown gets the point after all he is taken about in his cars with not a care in the world he probley doesn't even no how much it woud cost to fill a tank up.
well he has so much wages it doesn't matter anyway as most of his houses is paid for claims on the council tax claims on all he can get off us and me as a family person get nuthing middle wages get little hep if any.

I fully agree with protesting against road fuel costs as we are all aware we are being ripped off right left and centre by our government, however the one reservation I do have is anyone you speak to will say that they are fed up with being screwed at the pumps on fuel prices, but if there is interruption to supplies these will also be the first people that will say the protest is should not be holding the country to ransom. It will be the usual case it's quite all right for you to protest providing it doesn't affect me!

It is about time we took a stand against the continuing rising prices. Living in the country - unable to use public transport to get to work - so car essential.
We motorists should not have to be taxed to support all the other ways the government spends and wastes money.

Oil prices will go much higher post Peak Oil.

Let's campaign for more renewably generated electricity and a move to plug-in hybrid and all plug-in cars. Let's look to the future and ensure that it is survivable.

Im a tanker driver in the south east of England. I just wanted to make the point that approximately 70% of the pump price we all pay is tax, the remaining percentage has to cover the cost of exploration and extraction of oil in ever more challenging and contentious parts of the world to feed our demand for fuel. This remaining money also has to pay for the shipping and refining of the crude, the transport operation that delivers the finished product to the forecourts, and the retailers expenses. The cost of fuel in our country is way too high, but based on the approx 70/30 split of the pump price, its not the fuel companies ripping us off is it !!! ...the protest should be in Westminster.

The years of cheap fuel are over, so I don't see the point of protesting really.

We've known for a very long time that that the "oil age" was temporary and that one day it would come to an end.

Type "Peak oil" in your browser to find out what the world is talking about, and start planning with your friends and neighbours how you're going to deal with it.

I think it's time to take a stance on whats happeing with fuel prices. We as citizens are paying a fortune to fuel our cars. Most os us rely on our cars to get from work and back. Unfourtunately most of us cannot rely in public transport due to where we may have to travel. Now being self employed and driving it's now even more harder. Lower taxes on fuel and make life more easier for people that rely on vechicles.

Yes, peak oil is becoming a reality, and yes, tensions in middle east, an unfriendly venezuela and decrepit refinery infrastructure are contributing to the current high prices...

BUT, 70 pence and more per litre is taken directly by the government as tax, including vat of 17.5% on the amount of fuel duty, which is a tax on a tax.

I believe that whilst the duty is abhorent and a barely disguised pilfering of everyones pockets, it does put the UK in a position to benefit over other countries. Follow me here ....

In the US where there is little tax on fuel, consumers have seen prices more than double - now, it is true that filling up a car there may only have doubled from £10 to £20, but people get used to whatever level they have been paying for a length of time, so the US consumer is hurting loads at the moment. Here in the UK, we have seen the price of diesel go from roughly 88p/ltr back in july up to 108p now, or a 25% increase ...

What may give the UK an advantage here would be if some duty could be taken off to maintain prices around £1 per litre. Sure, over time, peak oil et al will cause oil to get upto $200 per barrel and the 'raw fuel price' element in the litre price may go from 30p up to 60p, but if the UK implements a handing back of duty over time then the UK consumer will be cushioned whilst all others, especially the US consumer, will be unable to cope. Our own consumer economy may be protected whilst everyone elses will be tipped towards recession.

It is not totally beyond the wit of politicians and their economic advisors to see this possibility. Hopefully we can help them on the way by supporting the protests and see if we can get an initial result similar to that gained by the Italian Truckers today.

My thoughts: 1. Oil price at all time high but sold in USD's which is at a ten year low so our fuel prices should be that of 1997.
2. In the 1960's there were many less cars and then the numbers started to grow so the roads were widened to cover the increase. But now everywhere you go now the junctions are being narrowed speed humps added etc. are these being added just slow us down OR increase our fuel use? On a motorway my 2.5 ltr V6 gives me 37 mpg. in Lichfield (the speed hump capital of England) whilst sitting behind an EMPTY BUS turning out thick smoke using subsidised fuel I only get 18 mpg. Is this because the powers that be at No 10 want us to use more fuel thus adding to their taxes so as we can pay for a war in the gulf costing £2000 per second.
3. Is it that this government claim to be green because there is now less diesel being sold here! They do this by allowing our roads to be overun by lorries from all over Europe breaking our laws on speed, mobile phones, hours, Overloaded etc. using tankfulls of fuel bought on the continent at a fraction of the cost here, whatever happened to the commmon market? As a result the uk transport business is closing down as they can no longer compete. Not only this our MP's drive Mercedes BMW (Tony Blairs came with its own immigrants I hear) Lexus, I ask what is wrong with british (built) cars Jaguar, Land Rover, Aston Martin, Think about the green side of bringing a car across the world before it's used.
4. My last point, I hear BP was fined in America $300 million for price fixing at the same time as all the worlds fuel companies are reporting record profits. My thoughts!!!!

I thought this site was for people who want to know where to find cheap petrol! CAR USERS.
Those of you you who are moaning about cars and fuel should stick to your push bikes turn off your computers switch off all your electricity and leave us in peace.

I'm willing to bet that a lot of the people who mentioned Peak Oil and who are trying their best to warn people that we must do something about CHEAP PETROL are already generating their own electricity...

JAMES SMITH: Chairman of Shell U.K. 29th October 2007.

Well I wouldn't say that oil is running out. There is a talk about 'peak oil' but I don't actually subscribe to the peak oil principle.

Somehow people are saying that oil is running out, I don't think that's the case. Probably the easy oil has been found, the big fields with the light crude that's easy to produce and what we are looking into a future of is very substantial hydro-carbon resources that are going to be more difficult to produce.

There are a set of technologies available on fossil fuels and in renewable energies that can get us where we need to be and what we need to do is get on and get them implemented.


*************


In other words, stop this useless government throwing money into illegal wars in the middle east and start concentrating on building renewable power at home while the oil lasts so that we're not hung out to dry with nowhere to go.


These protest are about taxation and rubbish politics ...not about anyone ignoring climate change.

"little or no media coverage" - a comment made earlier.

Strange isn't it that we have heard very little.

Indeed, for the protest to be a success it HAS to have media coverage. Lots of it. The government recognise this. For those in this country who think we have free press / media, I'm sorry to disappoint you. There is every chance certain "representatives" from certain "enforcement Gov. departments" have contacted media heads and warned them to give it little air time if at all. Thus the impact of the protest will have all the effectiveness of a damp match.

As for commentors on "peak oil" - at this moment in time, whilst there is "some" substance to what is said- you are about 200-500 years too early - so go crawl back in your holes and come out then and when you do come back out, balance your argument better with the alternatives rather than claiming "we are all doomed unless we go back to using the horse and cart and of course all have 2 or 3 acres of land to grow all our own produce and of course have our own wind turbine...unless of course it spoils someone's view from their window.

For people making the claim hydrogen is the future - this may well be. I dont know. But you would have to be a fool if you think that the goverment won't tax that in some creative way too. They are not easily going to kiss good bye to billions in revenue.

This protest is about the cost of oil and the cost of tax. Yes tax is inevitable it is after all next to war, the greatest sociopolitical control there is. Tax isnt just about the government it is also about the big fat cats raking in huge profits. Arguably, yes research and development costs real money but this is about outright greed.