Your Comments

Surely this is not the way forward? Just more taxation against the motorist.

Hiya,
The government are trying to say how people on lower incomes will have to use public transport to get around. Have they looked at how much it costs to catch a bus?????? When this first came out I thought fair enough I will look into getting a bus pass for me and my husband. They are charging £450 for a yearly pass each. So thats £90 a month for 10 months for 2 people. How are people on low incomes meant to be able to afford that??????

I have just read your arguments for this new idea of charging car drivers for using our roads. I have been driving in the UK for more than 40 years and also in Germany, France, Belgium and Italy, as well as the USA. Do you know that we have the most cameras in the whole of Europe in our country and now we are going to be tracked whereever we go?

I work in an industry that promotes working from anywhere! We provide the infrastructure to allow people to work from their homes, with the provision of a broadband connection and Voice over IP and MCS desktop client, I can work as if I am at my desk in the office, without driving 40 minutes (in off peak time) each way to my offices.

This type of working is not suitable for everyone, but I am sure that it could be a solution to a lot of traffic on the roads today and in the future.

My approach would be to provide a tax incentive to all companies that allow their employees to work from home and maybe just travel to the office once or twice a week. There are many people in my offices that would welcome this, as this also provides a much richer type of work/life balance, particularly if there are children to be cared for.

The incentive would actually be manifold:
1. Companies would get a tax benefit for each person that worked out of home,
2. Companies would also save money on company cars and fuel they provide today to their employees
3. Companies would contribute to cleaner environments and pollution reduction
4. Workers would be happier and therefore this would reduce churn of staff within the company.
5. We would not need further investments in new road schemes, some of which could be put toward rewarding the companies that encourage home working.

A further incentive could be given to companies to open smaller, local branch offices, instead of large multi-building headquarters, where everyone has to go each day...

Furthermore, the idea of School buses is something that has been around for a long time, but not been introduced here in the UK and I know why...it costs money!! In the US, School buses are running every day very successfully and have done so for a very long time...
Every morning at peak time, it is quite clear that School transport is the MAJOR cause of congestion, as well as when Schools end mid afternoon. This is clearly recognized when half-term arrives and traffic at peak hour in the morning is literally halved. So, let's put some of these billions of Pounds into a proper School transport system..which will reduce congestion a great deal in all towns and cities.

So, let's tackle this from a very different direction, rather than just the motorist, who in most cases has no choice regarding usage of a car to make their money to pay for all the taxes that are already being taken from our monthly income, (40% + 17.5 VAT + Road Tax + Fuel Tax + Council Tax + + + +) amounting to more than half of income being taken by the Government!
As for those people that have never had a child or a family, please do not tell families to give up their cars...have you ever tried to take a bus with a baby in a buggy and maybe another smaller child, a handbag and several shopping bags to carry..only to find that you get no help from the bus driver, no help from anyone in the bus and no seat, probably being soaking wet, as the bus shelter is broken or non existant!! Try that for a few days and tell me that you don't want to use a car...

I think that heavier penalties for motoring offences would produce revenue, improve road safety and only (financially) punish the people who most deserve it.

Imagine the impact on driving whilst on the 'phone if the penalty when an offender was caught the third time, was that the vehicle they were driving was confiscated and crushed! You might argue that this wouldn't work as the offender may be driving someone else's car. Well if they have two convictions on their licence and face the possibility of a third, they wouldn't be borrowing my car and I can't imagine they would be able to hire a vehicle or use a company car or firms van. Crushing a third offender's car may initially seem draconian but I think it would contribute greatly to road safety and congestion problems.

Serious problems need serious solutions.

I believe that motorists already pay tax per mile because of the fuel they need to travel on the road. The more a vehicle is used, the more fuel is used. The percentage of tax on fuel in this country is already very high anyway and since the more fuel we use, the more tax we pay as individuals.

I am also tired of being taxed to the hilt for working hard. I need my car to secure employment. I pay road tax, I pay car insurance and tax on that and I pay tax for the fuel I use. If the Government invested the tax revenue that motorists pay into a reliable and available public transport system then I am confident that the British Public would happily use it. Instead they penalise the motorist at any opportunity under the pretext of the environment while running about the town in chauffeur driven cars which the tax payer pays for) complaining about motorists lack of social conscience.

I do not agree with the idea that the motorist should be penalised because the public transport system is inadequate. I live in a village in North Yorkshire; public transport to the town which is 12 miles away (and less than 20 minutes by car) would entail a 1/2 mile walk to a bus stop from my house. I have no problem with this, as I regularly walk 4 miles a day with my dogs, however if it's raining and I'm on my way to work I will be in a poor state when I get there and as I am a professional I need to look smart in the work place.

I would then need to wait for my first bus (which on a weekday comes once per hour, on a weekend comes once every 2 hours and there are no buses on Sundays). My 3 mile trip could take approx. 15 minutes. I would then need to change buses to town involving another wait in the open air as there is no bus shelter. Once on this second bus the journey will take at least 45 minutes unless I'm unlucky and the bus takes the villages route in which case the (12 mile) journey can take up to 1 hour and 10 minutes. I then get off the bus and walk another ten minutes to work.

If I lived in the city or main town where bus and/or train services were available then of course I would happily use them however I don't and the public transport available to me is not an option.

This government and the civil service which is supposed to implement policy is incapable of implementing and running such a complex scheme, every computer project they touch has been an abject failure! The Swiss and Germans have beeing trying to this satellite tracking on trucks for 10-15 years and they have also failed miserably.
In any event I believe it is highly improbable that this scheme will be tax neutral ie the Treasury will just 'trouser' the net proceeds from running both systems together , should it be implemented.
Finally, the usual culprits who increase in significant numbers each year ie the great 'untaxed' who use stolen cars, no driving licences, no tax and no insurance will get away with even more, the balance having to be added back to the costs for the 80% of law abiding motorists.

all the money collected in road tax instead of only part of it we would be able to keep the roads up to standard billions have been collected in the past probably only a small % has been used for upkeep

have these idiots that say that cars are a luxury, 1, ever tried to get to work for 05.00 in the morning?? on the public transport that dosnt get out of bed till 05.00 if you are lucky, 2, where does the money go that is being ripped off, of us year in year out with the cost of road tax ever on the increase?? why does this country not wake up and smell the coffee, without the car, the ever polluting lorries that ferry there morning breakfast that they have to have, there bog rolls that they wipe there arses and everthing else that makes this so called great country tick, sod it lets stand every motor vehicle in the country and see where that gets us

I think, we all realise that the volume of traffic on the UK road system is increasing at an alarming rate and if you believe the projected figures for car ownership over the next ten years, it's frightening. It's bad enough already. However, we all have to accept that motoring costs increase year on year (road fund licence, insurance, mot's). I do have to question the real motives for a scheme that will put huge sums of cash back into the Chancellor's coffers without any improvement to the public transport infrastructure (which is the only way you can get people to change their travel behaviour) and without any real benefit to the environment. This Labour Government and
its Chancellor, Gordon Brown, have broken so many pledges, since coming into office, apart from the 'Big One', Income Tax. Indirect taxation has grown astronomically and Mr. Brown is always looking for ways of extracting monies from the tax payer, particularly in ways we cannot avoid eg. Flight Taxes, Stamp Duty, etc., to boost his coffers in an attempt to balance his 'books'.
More to the issue in question. I believe that scrapping road fund licence fees and increasing the duty on fuel, would be a fairer way for everyone (the more miles YOU choose to motor, the more tax you pay) and you can't dodge fuel tax, (many thousands of motorists are driving currently without paying road fund licence fees (all that lost revenue, Mr. Brown).
I don't think people will use their vehicles less (as there is no real 'cheap' alternative for most of us). It could be that annual mileage, for a large majority, increases, rather than decreases, as people find the cheapest (mileage charge based on time of day and/or road), but longer, route to get to their destination.
Another point. To implement a mileage charge nationwide, is legistically enormous.
I have heard figures of £40 BILLION to set the scheme up and will it ever work!
The Government's record on national systems is diablolical. Just look at the CSA mess and currently the NHS computerised internal system (£12 billion already spent and the prediction by IT experts, is that it will never work, as intended, and will be quietly disposed of). I am led to believe that every car owner will have to PAY out of his own pocket for the monitoring device and its fitting to the vehicle, which could be around £400! INCREDIBLE!! A case of, 'paying the taxman for collecting the tax from you'! This Government is only interested in revenue raising schemes and this is just another one. The environment issues are secondary. One last thing. Presumably, the
Government will make it compulsary for every car to have a device fitted. What a task! I wonder what they will do to all those vehicle owners, (the same ones, perhaps, who aren't currently paying road fund licence fees) who avoid having one fitted. Clamp them? I feel a business opportunity coming my way. Perhaps not.
Don't get me started on how I feel about wheel clampers!!!

It feels as if this is a desperation measure by Government to gain more money via sneaky taxation. It is amazing that they don't manage to deal with the obvious problems of a poor infrastructure that has needed upgrading for decades. This idea shows any lack of thought beyond a feeling that there is a desperate need to be seen to be doing something with our congested road problem. The feeling is that eventually only those with enough money to pay will be able to drive all the time, the rest, like myself will drive only when we can afford to. I don't like this idea, I feel it has no insight and doesn't deal with the problem, just deals with grabbing more money.

I agree with those for whom public transport is not an option. In rural areas, bus services are few and far between. If they were better I would certainly use them. We managed perfectly well in London without a car - now we run 2, as my husband and I work in different directions. Back in London recently I was impressed by the frquency, and to me, ease of public transport. Why can't it be made like that in the rest of the country ?

To David and Una: If only it were that simple. I have a 90-year old mother and without a car it would take me between one and one-and-a-half hours to get to her in the case of an emergency, even though she lives only 10 miles from me. I also take her out for lunch regularly - and to make her stand around at bus stops in the pouring rain is not an option. I also need my car to get my shopping - and sometimes my mother's. I also recently retired, and by careful budgeting I can manage with my pensions - but this proposed tax would make it impossible. And Rob - yes, I do use my Freedom Pass on the buses and trains as often as I can. But then I have worked and paid taxes for 40 years and believe that I have paid for the right to do so. Suggestions in the past were to put a specific amount on a litre of petrol which would go to road upkeep etc. It would also mean that those using the roads the most - and those using petrol-guzzling vehicles - would pay more. However, I have my doubts that the money raised would go to the intended purpose - any more than this intended tax would.

If the Road Travel Tax is to replace the Vehicle License Tax and replace the tax on fuels then it makes sense and would not be seen as another stealth tax. I would also recomend that a basic 3rd party Insurance also be included so the people that curently do not pay for or evade a Road Tax and/or insurance for their cars will end up paying and covered by insurance. It makes sense to pay for this through petrol purchase though so the more you travel the more you pay. This also does away with the big brother aspect of expensive GPS units. I'm not sure how this would help specifically with congestions but would do away with a large part of the DVLA and Petrol Tax collections and these saved costs could be used to offset transport costs.

My bigest problem is I live in a small village with no transport before 07h00 and after 18h00 and only runs on an hourly basis and two hourly on Sundays. We have no choice if we need to get shopping from our nearest town 15 miles away than to use our own transport. Likewise, we living in the country do actually use our 4X4's and do not see why we should have to pay an excess.

I am not in favour of road pricing whatsoever, look at londons congestion charge, started at £5 a day, with the promise of no increase for 10 years, and LOOK, 3 years later, it been extended, and now costs £8 a day, just a way for local or central goverment to rake in the cash.
How about increase in age before you can get a licence, say 21, also how about, you only get to have a bus pass, if you give up your licence, both ideas would reduce the number of licence holders on the road, and may also save lives.
Also road tax should be scrapped, and replaced by a miles driven tax, maybe that would encourage people to use their cars only when neccessary.

Give me a viable and feasible publich transport system and I'll take it like a shot.

If the train could get me to work by 8.00 am without having to leave the night before and pay over £30/day for the privilege, I'd use it.

It is hard to understand the mentality of people who believe that any of us choose to sit in traffic, or even run a car for that matter, for the joy of it. How can you price people out of their cars without there being anywhere to price them out to?

We are left with the only conclusion that the only good reason to heavily tax busy roads is that it is obvious that the drivers already have no alternative and so are a captive market with no choice but to pay. The legislation also has the benefit of being robed in shades of green, with claims of it being a 'green' tax. Without an option it is just a tax on going to work.

Is it not illegal to prevent people from working?

Nice to hear the viewpoints on public transport and the need to get people out of their cars, however, this is fine if you are town or city based, but simply not an option if you reside outside of these areas.

Also nice to see that the blinkered few are still harking on about 4x4's even though it's been proven time and time again that these have little more impact in comparison to most "normal" cars....and that is not even in comparison to the hippocritical Prius which generates 40% extra carbon from both manaufacturing and running / disposal costs. Wonder how many Prius will still be on the road in 10 years time....I would hazard a guess and say very few....how many LR are...70%....manufacturing wise, one of the most carbon efficient, if not the most in terms of production, offsets and sustainability.

I would love to use public transport, but I am unable. Aside from the costs, convenience and lack of facilities, it simply does not work.

Burdening yet more tax onto people for running cars is unfair and will ultimately have a major impact on our economy. Yes, we have to tackle global warming, but it will have no impact if the real culprits are not brought to justice. i.e Planes, power stations etc etc.

Lets hope people start to get real and more specifically governments. The problems do not lie solely at the door of the car driver, get your policies to address the real issues and stop taking the easy option and the short term gain.....yes, we need action, but it does not necessarily mean that the views of a few is a fair representation of the nation.

If roads were in the same condition as in most of Europe and the public transport network as efficient and non-costly, then we could see where the money goes...roads are abysmal and PT a joke....as a voter, I would suggest you publish and justify why so little is spent. There is already far too much unfair taxation passed to the motorist.....getting people off the roads will impact the bank rolling of the NHS as well as public services...a lot to risk for a short term gain that in effect will be local (UK). Stop using the stealth taxes and just be up front.....tax me at 50% and be done with it.....then we can all get on with things. Stop hiding and be fair with your voting public...it is US after all that gave you the opportunity, do your job and stop pulling the wool over people's eyes. It is already a costly commodity (the car) or had you not noticed? Highest taxation within Euroland....get real Labour.

Road charging will not work. Plain and simple.

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Name one thing that is not taxed in this country?
All the Taxes goes towards rubbish like, Olympic games, "good causes", other peoples war, giving prisoners a better life.
What are MoT, Car Tax, Fuel Tax, Cabbing Tax, 4x4 Tax, Taxes when you buy your car...... whats all this used for?

For those who claim "cars are a luxury item" as their excuse for imposing higher taxes on cars, let's examine the facts of my specific predicament as a case in point:

- once a month (give or take) myself and my girlfriend visit my parents in Nottinghamshire (my mother is sick)
- we live on the outskirts of London
- we used to use public transport which meant doing so cost us:
- £28 tube (4 single tickets, zones 1-6)
- £90 train (2 "Weekender" returns to Newark from King's Cross - they're probably more now!)
- £16 bus fare (4 single trips on the local bus to my parent's town)
- that's a total of £1,608 a year!
- and the total journey time is about 3.5 hours


So I bought a car:

- nice base model Rover 600 1.8, cost £800
- uses about £20-worth of petrol each trip to Notts.
- is taxed at about £160 a year
- servicing, MoT, etc. perhaps £300 a year
- total cost the first year, INCLUDING buying the car: £1,500!!
- now it's down to about £700 a year
- journey time to my parents, usually a shade over 2 hours


Of course I'm going to run a car!! I'm not rich and it's NOT a luxury. Frankly, when you examine the price of getting the train is the one which looks like the "luxury", which is just laughable!

In every other European country the trains are used by people with low incomes, because they are:

- cheap
- reliable
- safe
- widely available

In the UK people with a low income drive a car, because successive UK governments have put an end to all the above by privatising and fragmenting our railways and other public transport mechanisms beyond recognition, allowing jokers like First Great Western to run up massive profits operating an awful service, by privatising what should never have been taken out of public hands - and for what? A few quid of some city banker's tax bill so they vote for you again in 2 years time!

Clearly, the British public transport system is no alternative to car travel, for rich or poor. Pricing people off the roads achieves nothing but confining low income folk to their locale. Don't feel sorry for me, because I can afford the train - I just don't because it's a horrific waste of time and money!

So for those who say cars are a luxury item, pull your heads out of your behinds and look at the real issue here. The CAR is the ONLY viable means of transport in this country where the public transport system has been repeatedly raped by greedy and vote-hungry men. Until the government sorts that out, they should forget about driving people off the roads.

Have you seen the latest? No more speed cameras. The little black box in your car will record your speed on whatever road you are on. Instant penalties, [of course]. It is only a debating point at the moment, [government spokesman], nothing has been decided, yet! Of course it is not an excuse to raise revenues. Do these people not realise that they are elected, by us, and can be defeated in a parlimentary election if they continue down this road?

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528 & Co - Idiots.

351 - Nail on the head.

To everyone who also lives outside a city, out of choice yes, but all the same....we are it would appear all in the same boat. I have just spent 3 hours trying to find out about ways of getting my kids from Pershore to Worcester for school, without it taking 2 hours....and costing the earth.....I can have neither it would seem. So until something realistic happens I will continue to waste an hour a day driving them.

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As a disabled peron, I need my car and find the comments of some of the posters here really offensive and self righteous.
As one person pointed out, a two mile round trip to the supermarket costs 44p, the bus costs £1.05 without the door to door necessity that disablement brings.
Additionally, the public transport system isn't clean or safe...people are always being attacked on buses and trains, my Grandson was relieved of his mobile phone recently on his way home from school. The buses smell and are full of rubbish, passengers odten smoke cannabis on the upper deck and the drivers are powerless to stop any of the problems and stand to be attacked just for fun anyway.
Now if were talking about cars polluting the atmosphere etc etc, lets begin with all the 4x4's especially those dropping the kids at school. Next lets tax all the great big BMW's and Mercs, Lexus...all the fuel drinkers. Leave the small economical and most environmentally friendly cars alone, especially those used by the needy.

Not one of the arguments for or against road taxing will change anything. Most of them are individual cases who for one reason or another either do or dont want it. The government will do whatever it wants,whether we like it or not. I personnally think we should pay for the milage we drive by dropping the road fund license and increasing the price of petrol.That way we wont drive unless we have to which would also help the environment. Either way, the only way any of us will get a fair deal [and not all of us will] is to vote with our feet and change this government.The labour party have done nothing in 10 years and they are not about to change their ways now. Eric

I dont care how many people sign up or email tony blare, they will have there tax one way or another.

The more you travel, the more you pay...seems right to me? The easiest way, forget satellite tracking, just put it on the price per litre.

The more litres you buy and use the more you pay. Drive long distances, pay more, drive a thirsty car pay more!

Easy!

How can we use piblic transport when it's a complete shambles. if you start work before 6am you'll never get to work. And if anyone has shared a bus with 50 beligerent schoolkids, they will never travel on Public transport again.
There is never congestion when the schools are off, so the problem lies there.

Hi Brendan,

I sure did sign the petition and also responded to Mr Blairs email with the following :-

Dear Sir's,

If you were truly committed as a Goverment to reducing congestion on our
roads why for heavens sake are you :-
1, Allowing the closure of sub post offices thus forcing people who want
this service to travel on our roads.
2, Likewise not taking a more proactive position with the banking industry
who are also forcing people to travel by closing down many rural branches.
3, This Goverment has backed in the face of local opposition many out of
town and in town retail sites from Tesco to the mulyi faceted all singing
all dancing affairs, thus again forcing people to travel as the small
local business that used to offer choice have been forced out.
4, Hospitals, super regional centres ?, again forcing people on to the
roads to attend treatment or visit loved ones.
5, Our local public transport infrastructure is dirty, unreliable and
expensive, do you really expect people to hang around on a prayer for
transport only to find that if id does turn up it is occupied by gangs of
intimidatary uncouth youth.

Don't expect a reply as this is not goverment.

Best regards

An ex Labour voter.


Best regards

Alex

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I get sick to death hearing about climate change and global warming Why are so many people caught up in this doctrine . This planet has been in existence for millions of years and in the space of few decades the so called 'informed' are spouting their doctrines about the world is getting warmer .

I for one, when I travel to New York e.g don't think its very warm, when 12 feet of snow is dumped on the City as happened recently, nor I should think do the Icelanders or Eskimos think so either .

There is Tony Bosworth (Friends of the Earth senior transport campaigner) in yesterday's Argus commenting on about congestion and backing the Public Transport forum.

For example, just take a day's customers levels at one out of town Supermarket - just imagine how public transport would cope with those hordes - all going in different directions with umpteen bags of purchases .

Imagine the fleet of buses needed just for one shop and think of the emissions they would have coming out of them .

It is a totally unimaginative fantasy to state that we should all use Public Transport; the roads would be at a deadlock all day with buses blocking every main road.

It is all very well talking about these nonsensical schemes, but in practice it would never work .

If everyone who travels into Brighton to work every day from incalculable numbers of different locations, there is no system in the world that could cope.

The only sensible answer is forget the idea of hundreds of fume producing buses on the roads and keep to the private car. I just could not conduct business having to get from A to Z in the space of a working day , nor could anyone else .

How about number plating all cyclists and make them pay for the use of the roads . I wonder then if they would be so keen to clog up the roads . At the moment they pay not a cent!

if the railways are so empty because people choose to take their car instead, and all these lorries are blocking up the roads and killing the environment would it not be a good idea for the private companies or government to invest money already raised by congestion charges/speed(safety) cameras in the railways so they can carry the bulk freight off the roads and only have smaller delivery vans in built up areas to deliver, this would reduce the amount of traffic and damage to our neglected roads and the environment,and we know the government likes to save money,so if we reduced the motorway from three lanes to two there would be less to resurface,or we could make the third lane for emergency vehicles which would save lives, and hopefully it would make these people who sit in the middle lane pull in, if there is to be a congestion charge it should be on these middle lane drivers oblivious to the world around them.

and i read about big 4x4's being such a nuisance even though many actually produce cleaner air than what went in.i would like to say also that because the cost of motoring is getting so expensive which may be a reason for so many uninsured drivers and the scams where people drive into you or pull out on you at junctions, i am afraid with a wife and kids on board i would much rather be in a 4x4,than an eco box made from regurgitated rice paper,

sure 4x4's cause more damage if they knock you down in the middle of the road,but thats just it (the middle of the road) i read once that you wouldnt stand on a railway line if a train was coming,so why do pedestrians insist on doing it when a car comes.
better education/road sense and the highway code/lets look at what our european counterparts already have in place and try to adopt and adapt it and make it better not just bolster the coffers with taxes and promises of reinventing the wheel.

If the Government want us to use public transport then they are going to have to cut the cost.

2 days ago my husband and I had a meeting near where we live and then we had to drive 400+ miles to another meeting the following day. These werent business meeting but personal. We checked for an open train fare ticket which was quoted at £506 return for us both. The cost of petrol for our round trip was approx £150. If we had of gone by public transport we would have had to get a bus to Preston as we are on the rail line which runs through Greyrigg, then the train to London, and then a tube across London and the another 40 minute train journey to our destination.

Also are the Government going to fund each and every one of us motorist to have the 'big brother' box fitted to their vehicles? I dont think so!! I understand that it is going to cost in the region of £800 - £900 to get these fitted. How are the people on low incomes going to be able to pay??


How much more of our hard earned money is going to go on tax? You are taxed at source, your fuel is taxed, your MOT is taxed, your insurance is taxed.

I was recently in Hong Kong, they have a fantastic metro system. The trains run every 2-3 minutes, day and night and in some parts you can use underground to walk from station to station. Never long to wait even when it is busy. We could learn a lot from them.

If the Government get their way with 'big brother' does that mean that buses will get them too? If so, surely this will mean higher fares !! Got you all ways :-(

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One thing to consider is those that have to travel by car as they live far enough away from any main public transport. After spending 20 years in a Norfolk village with one bus in and one out if you were lucky a car was essential. I have always considered the cost of using your own vehicle but if anyone has a large family and wants to get from one part of the country to another the cost is prohibitive. I believe any usage tax should be administered by reducing fuel tax and road tax with extra reductions for those who cannot afford to pay extra...means tested motoring. :-)

I believe that motorists should pay for their road usage but actually how to do it is not clear. The proposal, by the Government, would result in yet another form of monitoring. We have become, as the book 1984 suggested, a country under surveylance and control. Do we need any more prying into our private affairs. I think not. Increase the road fund licence based on vehicle size to a level that makes the use of gas guzzlers unattractive. A £1000+ licence does not seem out of order for the largest of vehicles. That and the current level of fuel duty should more than curb the increased number of vehicles and journeys. To suggest that this move is to reduce the production of green house gasses does not seem to take into consideration the exhaust fumes belched out by road transport both from our trucks but also those from abroad who add to the problem but pay nothing to help reduce it. Maybe we should look at freighting using the railways and get some of the trucks off the road.

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