Your Comments

It is obvious that David L has never lived in the country and tried using public transport. I was ill once and had to stop driving for a while andf what a nightmare to get around on public transport. I live in Camberley and wanted to go to Sunningdale. I got a bus to Camberley and had to wait an hour. I the caught a train and had to change at Ascot and wait 20 mins for another train to get to Sunningdale. All of this took over 2hours. By car from my house to Sunningdale takes 12 minutes!!!! So get a life David L and all those other people who harp on about public transport.

The government should accept that a car is the way of life for people (especially the poor) and instead of thing ways of taxing us to the hilt they should entice people to use more public transport by reducing bus and train fares. To go to London now at peak time is in excess of £21 and then you will not get a seat either!!!

So lets have more ideas on improving the cost of public transport rather than these so called do gooders who buy food from all the major supermarkets who transpoprt the products in on the roads from afar and by plane.

It is important to note that the government have taxed people flying but NOT cargo. Why not? A plane is a plane whether it is filled with people or cargo.

I wonder just how many more people would have signed the petition if more than one could sign from one address. My wife wanted to sign too but her surname is the same as mine, so are her home and email addresses, so she was unable to register her opposition to road pricing.

Dont agree with road charging at all as living in rural areas we would be really hit hard. The way to reduce congestion in my book is to test drivers every 10 years and make the original test equivalent to the advanced drivers test. That will sort the sheep from the goats !!

I sincerely believe that any attempt to tax according to the distance driven is unfair. There are many people, myself included who live some distance from a shopping area. Our bus service is virtually non existent, and to run out of- say a bottle of milk requires a journey of 18 miles to the nearest supermarket. We are already taxed because we live where we are by the hike in Council tax ( Our banding has recently jumped up two bands). The chances of an ambulance call out within a sensible time is remote in the event of an heart attack. The use of a car in the circumstances would be absolutely essential, provided that the patient was not the driver!! I have retired, but my mileage is in the region of 30,000 miles annually. Do not consider this latest taxation scam.

They call it road pricing, but it IS just yet a further stealth tax.
Why does a motorist have to pay road tax, that goes little towards the repair and upkeep of the highways, then fuel tax, which goes directly to Gordon & Co. and then Insurance Premium Tax on the policy to cover the car?
We are being stripped left, right & centre, but the Government has still not had their pound of flesh.
I therefore signed the petition to say NO to this policy, which has been dressed up as a way of reducing congestion.
With more people wishing to be mobile at a younger age, pehaps the Government should consider raising the Driving Test age to say 22, so that the maturity of motorsits is expected to be greater, have all new motorist complete a 'safer driving'/Pass Plus test and perhaps have interim Driving Tests at 40 and 60?
This should maintain drivers current knowledge and roadcraft, to allow respect for other road users.
Also if there were tax benefits given to those who could work from home and thus not travel - to reduce congestion - then there would be safer and fewer drivers on the roads.
Bottom line folks, there is no single answer to solve the problem, but penalising those who use the road, for the sole benefit of the Government/Treasury, when there is no say by the paying motorist as to where the funds go, IS JUST NOT ON!!

My 90 year old mother-in-law would be housebound if we did not take her out in the car. I often walk where possible, but this is not an option for her and she cannot use public transport. Those of us willing to try public transport often find it much dearer than using the car. For my family to travel to a local out of town shopping centre would cost over £15. It is less than 10 miles so costs us less than £1 for petrol and parking is free. There is no element of choice here. We take the car. If the government want to cut congestion then they have to provide cheap public transport.

We already pay depending on how 'green' our cars are and how far we drive. This is the whole excuse for the high rate of duty on fuel. We run a Smart car - low VED because of the low number of CO2's emitted, high MPG (in the 60's). The whole reason for buying such a car is to reduce our commuting costs.

With the new 'tax', it appears that we would be much worse off as it would seem that those who can drive at a time to suit, and who drive large-engined vehicles would be the winners. It doesn't take a scientist to work out that those 'winners' are likely to be the better-off drivers who do drive gas-guzzlers, and who don't HAVE to be in work at fixed times.

Perhaps there needs to be a 'school run' tax as the majority of drivers on our local roads between 8am and 10am are women taking little Nigel or Nigella to school.

i work shifts and can be going out to work at 5am and coming home at 11pm. there is not suitable and frequent enough public transport at other than normal transportation times. if there was a reasonably priced and frequent enough service to get me to work in time for my shifts, then i would consider using it. i hate driving these days due to congestion and understand the need to take some sort of action, but it is not fair to tax people for using their cars. there is not a good enough alternative for the majority of people. public transport is not the answer in it's present form. the buses can be old,dirty inside,too crowded and too expensive. if the government want people to use public transport, then they need to plough more money into it to improve it radically. but then, hey, our taxes would go up to pay for it. it's a vicious circle !!!!!!

I find it amazing that the small percentage of the population that go out and work on a daily basis (taking into consideration the retired, children, those unable to work etc) are being targetted by the government as the cause of polution. We have to get to the office in the morning and come home in the evening, it's a fact of life. Why target us with congestion charging, higher rail fares etc. We have to be in the office, we have no choice, how we'd all love to stay a home, but no, we get sacked if we don't show up for work. Perhaps the government needs to pressure companies into letting more people work from home, allow more flexitime etc. What about the post, they all use vans etc, how else will the post be delivered. How about mail order? We all are encourage to go out less, buy online etc, but it's all got to be delivered. Are we all supposed to give up our cars and leave the roads clear for the Royals, politicians, flaming celebrities and the service industry?

Has anyone actually used public transport recently.... it's pathetic. Dirty, late, expensive, means standing around in the cold and rain for ages, being surrounded by people coughing and sneezing all over you, being pushed around, standing in queues just to buy a ticket, being late, seeing less of your family as you have to get up earlier and get home later due to delays.

Government, sort out the pathetic state of our public transport and perhaps more of us would consider it, and even then it only works for those in urban areas. For those of us, the only logical and economical method of transport is the car. Get the car companies to reduce emissions, the combustion engine is an antique and with modern technology there could be improvements made, but don't forget, all those "greens" pushing for electric cars, where does the electricity come from...... you've got it, a power station, and what's that burning, most likely coal.... or it's nuclear and then the "greens" kick up a stink that it's unsafe and poluting despite being a "clean" fuel, but that's another story..... GGRRRR

Oh, and one last thing, it's it a joy to think we're being pushed into overcrowded trains and busses and giving up our cars or being charged off the face of the earth to use them, whilst India and China pick up where we left off, buying a nice new car and enjoying the freedom of movement, the fact they don't have to struggle to work on an overcrowded train.....

After sitting on the M2 this morning for 2 hours because of an accident on the M20 and then listening to colleagues complain that they couldn't access the M2 because all the junctions were gridlocked I realise that in Kent we have too few roads. On the other hand I watched train after train whizz past - perhaps we should have more trains becaues they work! Afterall the M2 is 4 lane and is usually no problem - it only takes one accident to bring us to our knees

As a Community Care Assistant it is essential that I use my car to travel to & from clients homes to provide support, care and assistance to the most vulnerable people. These people often fought in the war to protect and ensure freedom to our country. You must realise that this service is essential in providing support to the elderly, Mentally disabled, the & the disadvantaged. If I needed to pay extra tax for the use of my car in peak times I would possibly have to reconsider my job, which I see as an important part of their lives as I am often the only person these people see all day. Of course I am not the only person this tax could effect you could argue that Doctors. District Nurses and other proffessionals could be put in the same position. It is a pity this government do not realise the impact that this tax could cause, instead of taxing drivers who wish to carry out their proffession, why not fine the drivers who hog the middle lane of the motorway causing tail backs!

Of course the only green tax is to tax the fuel. There is no sane argumant against it: the more fuel you use the more you pollute. The best incentive not to pollute is to tax fuel usage.

Of course this only works where people are polluting by choice.

Does it not occur to anybody, especially in that surreal parallel universe called the government, that the more you tax necessities and commodities, the weaker you make the economy? You take money out of the populace's pocket, or even worse, price them out of going to work, you damage GDP.

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I will never accept the principle that every journey i make in my car will be tracked and recorded on some database for the government (of any persuation) to make use of for any purpose.This is not the ideals for which i fought in our armed forces.The purpose of the tracking is not relevant.This is big brother and the nanny state gone mad.

Post 803

I agree in those being unable there is no alternative. But don't worry, if you have a disabled road tax your car is already registered for disabled use. You are therefore excempt from paying the charge if it is ever brought in. Including the congestion charge. just incase you did not know.

DLA, at the High Rate, is money the goverment gives is to help pay towards the cost of running a car. If you used this money to obatin a mobility care they would maintain the car and pay for your insurance.

To have 830 comments on this site is totally out of proportion not one person can read 800 plus comments

Rather than bashing all 4x4s or all of anything else why not pause a moment to consider the so called embedded life cost to the environment of vehicles. I read recently that if this approach, which takes into account the environmental cost of materials for manufacturing, the manufacturing process itself, the fuel and parts used during the life of the vehicle and the end of life disposal/recycling costs, were used on a Toyota Prius petrol electric hybrid compared with a Jeep Wrangler 4 litre petrol the Jeep would come out on top for the environment as it is simple, cheap and quick to buil or repair, there are plenty of used parts around to recycle and it will last for 25 or more years if maintained...........
Fact is car manufacturers do not want cars to last that long and governments are scared of them as they are vast corporations employing millions of people. They can get away with environmental damage but bullying politicians will go for individuals to make themselves look green but without making really serious changes that might make a genuine difference.

I think road/charging is a cop out by the Executive and another way of raising additional revenue. Instead of road charging more thought needs to be taken about removing some of the heavy goods traffic travelling on our roads today with incentives for transfer to rail. If this was done effectively then congestion would be reduced and perhaps the same problems with volume would not occur.

Ever since I was a young boy I always thought that public transport (all sorts: Bus, train, tube, coach) should be provided free to all and sundry, and paid for out of taxes. That way people who choose to travel by car are effectively paying twice (paying for public transport through taxation, and paying additionally for running a car). If public transport was free, more people would want to use it and public demand would ensure investment to develop a well equipped public transport system. If such a public transport system were in place, less people would want to use their cars as a good viable alternative would be available.

This in turn would mean that:

a) the overall spend per head in the UK would be lower as it's more efficient to share transportation

b) Pollution overall would be lower

c) In general we would be healthier and better off financially.

Is this a simplistic view of things? I dunno. I could see this clearly when I was about 10 years old & most of the rail network got scrapped. What is it about politicians??? Or have I got it wrong.,

Unfortunately the English government want it both ways. Tax the motorist at every possible opportunity yet not supply an adequate road network. The taxation is a double whammy, it's no wonder the government of the day don't want to improve the road network as it would mean more efficient travel by vehicles with less emmissions and improved fuel economy which, yes you've guessed it, LESS REVENUE.

If the government were to follow the European model and give the choice of an improved road network at a cost to the motorist or use the existing worn out pot-holed road system for the current taxation, I am sure they would be more popular. They can't have it both ways.

I for one will re-register my car in France and shaft them!!!

Come the next election, why don't all who have complained vote to get rid of the Labour Party whose sole aim and object is to tax us until there's no more. Roads are in appalling condition, especially in Scotland, wide highways have been artificially narrowed so that they can create the congestion that they are now trying to make us pay for, fuel prices are amongst the highest in the world due to taxation. I need a car as I have to travel from the Moray Firth to the Borders to make a living and I already have to leave at 6.00 a.m. to avoid the congestion in Glasgow which adds two hours on to my working day, sitting still, burning fuel and getting nowhere!!

The easiest way and fairest of all is to remove the Road Tax, then increase the tax on the petrol pro-rata and if you drive 200 miles a week, or only drive 20miles a week then isn't that fair that you pay at the pumps.
This will never happen as the Government (any Government) know these answers already,and do they act on them, not a chance, as they will never bite off the hands that feed their treasury coffers, what with road tax, petrol tax, congestion charges, speed cameras, average speed cameras etc etc...
Anyway why is everybody wanting to get on public transport as these companys are never ran for the benefit of the public......oh! I forgot, they do, but only if the routes are profitable.

I signed the petition because:
1. I do not beleive the money will be spent on road improvements.
2. I believe it yet another stealth tax.
3. I am in favour of toll rolls where there is an alternative free option e g the M6 and the M6 toll.
4. I am in favour of toll rods which are run by private companies but not by the government.
5. I am a pensioner and I need the car for essential journeys only. The cost of fuel is already high and my pension is limited.

I do not think road congestion will be reduced if people are forced to pay proportionally to their participation in congestion. The British public have a long history of bearing up under ridiculous rates of taxation and pricing without changing their practices.

The argument that road pricing will make the goverments revenue from road users fair and proportional to use is I think secondary to the government seeking to increase the value of revenue from road users and will not see any reduction in fuel tax.

I currently pay less than 200 pounds pa for road tax and in excess of 2500 pounds pa on fuel of which fuel duty and vat account for 60% which is about 1500 pounds pa. This a cost which has risen, in my twenty years on the road, out of all proportion with the governments increase in expenditure on road maintenance and infrastructure.

The government raises a stupendous amount from road users yet have failed to spend this wisely on any measures that could reduce peak traffic flow congestion, alternative means of transport or meaningful legislation to alter working prctices which by and large lead to rush hour congestion.

It would be ridiculous to stand the cost of implementing such a system, infrastructure, data collection, billing, policy groups for pricing, appeal procedures non of which adds value to improving our road conditions.

Also I don't trust the higher powers, i'm fond of my civil libertys its why I still live here being slowly taxed to death, if the Government want to know where I am and where I'm going and where I've been they can ask me and I want to reserve the right to not tell them

Vehicle tracking and road pricing will do little to tackle congestion. Most people would rather pay more than give up their cars, particulalry when mass transport is overcrowded or takes too long to get from where we live to where we work. Road pricing would need to be considerably more expensive to make car travel less attarctive than mass transport. (Can we please stop calling it public transport- there has been no such thing in this country since 18 years of Conservative government effectively abolished it.)

Example: I save 2hrs on my day by driving rather than taking the train, albeit driving outside rush hours by altering my work hours (appreciate that many cannot do this). I'd rather pay for mrunning my car than lose potentially 10 hours of my time per week.

The real connundrum is how to pay for the creation of fast integrated mass transport. Like British financial institutions the public now have become both investment and tax averse. As the petition has shown, people now love their cars too much. Long-term investment in mass integrated transport from road pricing/car tax/fuel tax income will be the only way to break the vicous cycle but polirical parties and the driving public are not brave and selfness enough to make the right thing happen.

Taxation is all about Government finding ways to generate substantial income and the Ministers and Civil Service find ways to do this.

And the best way of generating income is from the "largest" groups - so smokers have been hit, people who fancy a pint, or who want to go on holiday abroad or run a car or insure their homes and contents or buy electricity and gas to cook and ehat their homes with, etc, etc.

In the case of road pricing, the Govt are trying to put up a smoke screen, saying it's all about congestion and the environment.....in fact, it's just about raising revenue so the Govt can balance it's books.

Added to this is the fact that by hitting those people who have no alternative (which is how the Govt operates - see above !), so if implemented, this scheme will have the greatest chance of generating the tax income the Govt. wants. And this is because if there WAS an alternative (such as public transport, in this case), the Govt wouldn't receive the income it says it needs.

So, how can this be prevented? In the long run, it can't as Govt. will always get their way. In the short term, protest groups can be set up and letters can be written to your local MP - remember the "Poll Tax" riots of a few years ago? - the Poll Tax DID get changed although now we're all lumbered with Council tax...it's still the same tax, just being "wrapped up" differently.

But the issues of "road charging" go further, in terms of privacy as well as pricing certain roads and/or area's out of reach for many who cannot afford it.

Having driven in many other countries, I've seen better ways of tackling "congestion" and I hope that the Govt. are made aware of these other options and implement them on a local level, rather than by having some Civil Servant decide how much we are going to have to pay to use a certain road at a certain time of day.

By the way: When will all the foreign trucks that seem to be using our roads more and more, be made to pay Road Fund Tax? Travel down any motorway and all we see are said trucks that have not made ANY contribution to the cost of maintaining our roads - and mostly, they don't even "fill up" here, as they have such huge fuel tanks, they usually fill up in a cheaper country before coming over here !!. While we need goods delivered by them, isn't it about time they paid their way?

It is risible to think that any extra tax paid by motorists would be spent to improve the transport infrastructure. The current government has had 10 years in which to improve our transport infrastructure and failed miserably. The previous government also had 18 years in which to improve our transport and also failed.

Governments have no history in taking transport seriously. They target cars because it is easy to soak owners and drivers in ever increasing taxation. I personally commute into London on a daily basis and paid £3250 per annum for the pleasure. However I can assure you that it is not actually a pleasure. With monotonous regularity the system fails leaving commuters late, frustrated, crowded, and often having to put up with appalling behaviour from other commuters. At the least in my car I can sit in real comfort listening to my own music and travelling to exactly where I want to go. However individualism is not something that governments wish to support and so the motorist is deemed to be a daemon. We must resist any attempt to make motorists the scapegoat for their lack of foresight and inability to govern properly.

816 - you've got it in one.
We need the roads clear so we, the politicians can get to our lunchtime and evening get-togethers quickly without mixing with the riff raff.
As we drive past you rebels waiting for a bus we do expect a degree of respect, after all we are taxing you to the hilt to make our lives(politicians) much better for our retirement.
We know we will be out at the next election - but what the heck - I'm retiring to the US, with the wife, writing my memoirs and enjoying life in a decent country.
Wake up and realise you are all being taken for fools.

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My guess is those who are in favour of taxation either have plenty of money, live 50 yards from a train station or bus stop, work 9-5 monday to friday OR are on benefits.

The whole idea of every tax is to make sure none of us can retire and have to work so hard that we have a heart attack 3 weeks after retirement.

So far I am 26 years old and have worked since I was 12. But i'm not really any better off than those who left school with nothing, signed onto the doll and sit in the pub every day.

This debate is not about the environment, global warming, saving the fluffy rabbits. It's about taking as much money off the workers to fund the dossers and over paid government workers.

If the environment was so important, then plane tickets to new york would be about £3,000 not £99.

I live in rural south Cheshire where the bus service is somewhere between non-existent at worst and execrable at best. I run my own business and must get out to see my local clients. A car is essential in my situation and there is no credible alternative. I lived my first 25 years in Edinburgh and should I still live there I would not bother owning a car as the local public transport is superb, (as it is in London, Manchester, Birmingham etc).

But my more deep-seated concern is this government's passion for examining every aspect of our lives and their associated liberties. How long do all of you supporters of this plan think that it will be before the security services simply have to click a field in a request form in order for tracking to be enabled on our movements? How long before a cash strapped treasury, (as Mr Brown continues to squander our taxes), decides to set automated speeding fines?

I am all for heavier treasury funding of the rail system in order to remove heavy haulage and very long distance personal travel from our roads, but as usual, the city based policy makers of our country take the narrow personal view.

Tremendous comments from you all - what an interesting blog to read. From those of you who point out that as disabled drivers, you would be hit the hardest - surely we would all campaign for you to be extended some tax break or other allowance? From the tone of Mr Blair's response to the petition, it sounds like this is a decided matter anyhow.

Regards to you all

Simon

I've wondered for years why we have such a complicated way of administering our road vehicles when there seems to me to be a relatively simple way to do it. Abolish the road tax as it is,then.

1) tax would be gathered from the fuel tax. More you drive more you pay.

2) insurance would be shown by disc in window. As road tax now.

3) MOT certificate as now with disc for windscreen.

This has always seemed to me to be a lot easier to administer and at the end of the day those of us who either do the most miles or have the thirstiest cars obviously pay accordingly and no one can escape paying, unlike the present system and as we are all computerised nowadays MOT and insurance should also be safer



Posted by A Bennetts, 22nd February 2007 9:55pm

I agree and nothing else is better than this method!
Wake up Tony Bair/Gordon Brown you're losing my vote!
Do this and I won't vote for you no more!
I mean it!
So think before do anything stupid!
Think and be fair for everybody, upper, middle, lower class and able & disable people, think of us British and focus this county not middle east or anywhere else.
Don't waste our money!
THINK!

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I am a disabled person and need to travel from door to door. But does'nt everyone want to do that? Who wants to stand out in all weathers waiting for buses or trains which are probably the worst in Europe. As for taxes the road tax is a fair system, everyone pays and fuel tax is fair, the more you travel the more you pay. What's wrong with that. Remember the old saying, if it aint broke don't fix it.

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I DID NOT SIGN THE PETTITION. I TRIED TO BUT DOWNING STREET REJECTED IT BECAUSE I HAVE THE SAME EMAIL ADDRESS AS MY HUSBAND WHO HAD ALREADY VOTED. INCIDENQATLLY YOU WOULD NOT LET ME VOTE IN YOUR POLL FOR THAT SAME REASON. I WOULD SUGGEST THAT AT LEAST ANOPTHER MILLION PEOPOLE WOULD HAVE SIGNED THE PETITION IF THIS RESTRICTION DI NOT APPLY BECAUSE ON AVERAGE THERE IS 1.5 PEOPLE PER EMAIL ADDRESS.

I am a home carer and I travel around my area helping elderly and disabled clients. As it is I get next to nothing for my car expenses which means I am getting paid a lower amount than those who do not drive. If this tax would mean my costs would go up, I would have to find alternate employment.

I live in a rural area , the public transport around here is a shambles , there is no way you could rely on it for getting to work or going shopping , especialy now all the local shops have closed and we have to travel to the supermarkets some 5 miles away , if the goverment had acted when warned by the farmers in the late 70's ,and looked after the small traders ,we would not now need the car to do our shopping , far healthyer and better for the enviroment also, this presant goverment will put a tax on and dambed thing that the public begin to use , be it public transport , cars , planes , bycicles , yes bycicles , the tyers are made of rubber , natural yes , comes from the enviroment , lets put a tax on that as well , we pay tax on our wages , tax on our saveings , vat tax when we spend any , tax on the bloody petrol , some people travel loads of miles and go nowhere , nurses (district ) , vets , doctors ect, and to top it all we have the most expensive fuel in the eu anyhow , let the ministers shove it in a shady place ----
John