“The action of taking property unlawfully from a person or place by force or threat of force”; the legal definition of robbery.
‘Robbery’ perhaps may be a little harsh, although if you consider the threat of having your car clamped, towed away or just punitive financial charges to be forceful, then it could work. If you’ve ever been caught at a car park without the correct change, only for the machine to tell you that ‘No Change Given’, you’ll have an understanding of the point.
If you’re paying for £1.60 worth of parking with two £1 coins, you’re not getting any extra, you don’t a credit for the next time, you can’t stay any longer (unless that rolls you into the next time slot), you’re just giving the parking operator free money, and they really do view it as free money.
NCPs free money
NCP typically make just under £700,000 per year from overpayments – all of those odd bits of payments that they hang on to when their machines won’t give change; between 2009 – 2012, NCP made an extra £2.44m just from these overpayments alone.
You could argue that the onus is on the driver to ensure that they have the correct money, which is a fair point, but sometimes life doesn’t work out that way, and with technology being as it is, why can’t there be card payments? Or smart parking using your smartphone?
It’s a lucrative little hustle for car park operators, it just happens that NCP are the biggest operator in the UK with over 600 sites managed or owned by them. It has been described as ‘fleecing the motorist’ by an RAC spokesman, and yet that still isn’t the ‘free money’.
Tax avoidance (gone wrong)
Her Majesty’s Revenue & Customs (HMRC) have recently been in court with NCP, with the car park operator as the claimant, after HMRC deemed that the £2.4 million pounds should be subject to payment of the 20% VAT tariff.
It seems as though NCP wanted to recoup the near £490,000 VAT payment to HMRC, and used the legal process of the High Court to try and do just that, after an earlier appeal went against them. The basis of their defence, and their subsequent appeal relied on the argument that this money wasn’t a direct payment for a service, that the parking had already been paid for, so the overpayment was just that. (A bonus?)
Lord Justices Newey, Patten, and Males dismissed NCPs claim, deeming that it was the total sum paid that covered the parking charge, and therefore, entirely valid for the HMRC to claim VAT on the figure.
Pete Williams from the RAC stated: “Everyone who has been unlucky enough to be fleeced in such a way by a car park operator will view this appeal with utter contempt” and Edmund King, AA president had similar views: “Drivers who have wanted to give left-over parking time to another motorist but been prevented by measures to stop tickets being transferred will have a wry smile on their face when they hear this court ruling”.
Have your cake and eat it too
Of course there is a simple solution to the problem; give change, take card payments or implement a system that can be accessed from an App – all three solutions would negate the issue, but at nearly £700,000 a year, the car park operators are unwilling to do that.
Perhaps the most galling part of this, is the ‘wanting your cake and eating it too’ greed of the operators; surely, if they’re making free money (remember, according to them, they’re not offering a service for this money), the least they could do is pay tax on it graciously.
The increase in technology means that we’re moving further toward a cashless society with each month that passes – paying for smaller items is as simple as a swipe of a card, or wave of a smartphone, and payments by card overtook cash payments (by volume) over a year ago, so carrying a pocketful of change isn’t as commonplace as it once was.
On top of that, councils are already making huge profit in parking charges, and it seems that we now have to contend with the operators themselves joining the fray and removing even more money unnecessarily unless you classify greed as a necessity.
It would be great to see the authority owned car parks tackling this problem on our behalf, but unfortunately, that’s just probably wishful thinking.
Should parking operators still be able to get away with such shoddy practice? Perhaps you’d like to see the regulations tightened up? Can you think of one aspect of motoring that isn’t taxed in some way? Let us know in the comments.
Over-spent 40p recently as I only had 2 x £1 coins for a £1.60 ticket. All would have been fine if the machines accepted a card .. I tried FOUR different ones!! The chap in front of me tried his three .. and on two different machines. Wouldn’t have minded if it had given me the extra 40p worth of time, but no — cut-off was one hour. Felt cheated .. so glad that they aren’t going to be getting away with it. Perhaps if they can’t prove it was for parking the tax should be higher .. let’s say 100% so it doesn’t end up in NCP bosses bonuses.
They should pay tax on all the money they take, we have to.
I agree it money for old road. We all have to pay tax so why not NCP
This is the very reason people are now buying online because of the greed of NCP & Councils Etc especially Hospitals
Stockton-on-Tees have had to reduce parking fees to a £1 & Free on certain days just to get shoppers in
It is not a robbery but theft under the theft act 1968 s.(1), where a person (this applies to an entity), is guilty of theft if he dishonestly appropriates property belonging to another with the intention of permanently depriving the other of it. The actus reus is proven, but, the mens rea, the intention is arguable. However, in view of these latest cases this should be looked at under the criminal law as it appears that there is no way of mitigating the loss as there is no contract where the loser agrees to the overpayment. There is no excuse for this criminal act?????
Utter nonsense. They are not “dishonestly appropriating”. They are accepting a voluntarily given overpayment, made by customers with no expectation of receiving any value for it.
You may know a few terms such as mens rea and actus , but your post shows you know nothing about the law
Tosser which director of NCP are you?
It is nonsense to say that the payment was voluntarily given…
Voluntarily given overpayment. Hmmmmmm…………. who volunteers an overpayment? Maybe when one gives a tip. It’s not real this, is it ! How about agreeing to donate that overpayment to charity ?
You make a fair comment Mr Hampson.
Agree Tim, wouldn’t that be a lovely gesture to donate it but how many parking firms do you know that would be so ‘lovely.’ Automated machines that give change are everywhere now, supermarket auto-checkouts for example, are much more sophisticated and work well, so the money-grabbing parking scammers have no excuses, in fact they could use the £700k scammed cash to update their machines.
Perhaps NCP should commit to giving all ‘overpayments’ to a local chaity of choice, and present say 3 options (as many supermarkets now do using a token).
Absolute rubbish, they are dishonestly appropriating this money by not either putting in place a system for giving change & for deliberately keeping that change by stating that there will be ‘No change given’. This is anything but a voluntary overpayment, how the hell is any overpayment voluntary if it has been taken without the consent of the payee & I am 100% sure that, if asked, every last one of the people who have been overcharged would either want their change/money back or would want to use the money taken, without permission or consent, from them to have extra time at the parking place.
Where do you operate a NCP car park possible a hospital where people are even more vulnerable Idiot.
MY LOCAL HOSPITALS NOW CHARGE BLUE BADGE HOLDERS TO PARK ON THEIR GROUNDS! i CAN PARK ON YELLOW LINES OUTSIDE THE ENTRANCE FOR UP TO 3 HOURS FREE.
It’s not dishonest, they tell you you won’t get back the change. You have a choice to overpay or go elsewhere. Having said that, they are totally immoral in the pursuit of profit. Nobody wants to overpay, but choices are limited. I’m glad they lost the court case and have to pay Tax, hopefully this will affect all previous monies collected.
It should be illegal to not give change if no other payment method is made available I.e. of card payments or app payments are possible then ok, don’t give change, but if neither are possible then the machine should give change or issue free tickets
Or at least give you longer on the ticket.
I cant understand why, now that NCP have been caught steeling from everyone, and trying to evade tax, that they cant have their contracts taken away from them and given to someone else who will install the proper machines.
Parking charges are invariably unfair and that commonly includes the charges for hospital parking where “no change” is normal. One has to abide by a lot of rules; parking inside the lines but impossible if the car next to yours has parked over the line (often because the next car has done the same). The option is then to find another slot – not always that simple! As your article suggests – it is nothing short of a rip off and should be outlawed. Technology is now available.
That’s because the stupid b****rds can’t drive if you watch them park up even on empty spaces they still park outside the lines and don’t care about others
With regard card and app payments, why do we have to pay an extra charge to make their life easier. Another way big business fleeces drivers.
So if they are not offering a service then why should anyone pay to park there car at the end of the day if you pay to park your car then surely that should be classed as a service which would mean that they should be held accountable for many thing that happens whilst your car is parked on there car park if you have to pay for the privilege of parking on the car park
Why on earth would they think they don’t have to pay tax on this? I have to pay tax on my tips.
Dorset County Hospital parking machines expect you to pay in advance when you don’t know how long you will have to wait to be seen, they do not take cards AND they do not give change. Other hospitals such as Southampton General Hospital only asks you to pay when you leave, their machines accept cards & give change. What about some consistency in the NHS? Always give change & never ask to pay on arrival, before you know how long you will have to wait.
The obvious answer is to behave honestly and charge by the minute, as many European cities do. The machines exist but the acceptance of the loss of easy money doesn’t.
ALL parking should be provided out of the vast and virtually criminal taxes imposed on motorists as captive milch cows.
Maybe one way to destroy the greed would be to force the operators and the local councils to pay all of this “free” money to charity.
Were that law, I have a sneaky suspicion that all of a sudden, all the card machines which weren’t working would become fully functional.
Cynical, me? Probably.
“classify greed as a necessity” I Love that! Yes these greedy B’stards need brining to book. I’ve often been “done” by not being a BANK and having an infinite verity of “change” in my pocket. These companies and Councils have deliberately engineered the parking charges to extract overpayment where and when ever possible. and Cardless payment systems screw you for an “Admin Charge” in addition to the parking fee, which are often fixed for overly short or long periods.
The Motorist is not a cash cow, we use our vehicles because we have to.
Only ever used an “online” payment once…. the payment was 50p more than paying cash to the machine on site. Why when its simpler and cheaper for the car park companies, they dont have to handle cash or take it to the bank, why the extra charge..?
Dick Turpin would be proud of NCP.
At least Dick Turpin had the decency to wear a mask when robbing you!
No surprise really, parking firms trying to get as much money as possible. Pure greed no sense of decency or honesty.
They should pay double tax
As they are not providing a service for the over payment they should give it to charity.
Or, perhaps, back to the person who never wanted to give it in the first place.
If they offered extra time for the extra money it would be something. One of our local car parks charges £1.10 for an hour, no-one has 10p sloshing around any more so invariably you pay £1.20 or even £1.50 for not a single extra minute. I have no sympathy for NCP, just like every other large organisation they use their power to screw over people who have no choice but to pay up. Shame on them.
I would suggest none of us is leaving extra money voluntarily. I suggest we all write or email to the NCP advising we want the overpayment back every time an overpayment is unavoidable. This removes their puerile fallacy that it is voluntary. Additionally it is likely the thousands and thousands of emails will crash their system and hopefully annoy them as much as their non change giving, non card taking machines annoy us. Any takers on this idea. Anyone got their complaints dept address?
I would def email every time I overpaid if someone could post their email address.
I would request my money AND explain how I am voluntarily trying to crash their site.
A local car park has gone over entirely to card/phone payments after the local criminal fraternity decided to take a disc cutter to all their cash car park ticket machines. I would never endorse such criminality, but you don’t now risk over-payment!
There are many times when I’ve had to pay for 30 mins of parking when I’ve only needed 10, and several times not had the small coinage to pay for just 30. It’s also not as if the machines couldn’t calculate how much time you have actually put in coins to pay for, e.g. at a rate of x mins per 5p, and deliver a ticket with a corresponding expiry time. They are all, after all, software controlled, so the large increments of time and refusal to take appropriate and flexible forms of payment can only be described as deliberate profiteering, aka: robbery.
This day and age you should just be charged for the actual time parked and not rounded up to the next hour. My local hospital is £3 for an hour but go over that and you get charged £5.
But
This all pales into insignificance to the amount the treasury fleece us via the DVLA when you buy or sell a vehicle as your tax is back dated to the end of the previous month and they only refund full months when selling a car, so how many millions do they get every year from this, there’s no excuse now its all electronic, should only be charged from the date of vehicle on the road.
What about the insurance? If you have an accident and write the car off they will insist that you pay till the end of the policy term even though there is nothing to insure.
If you are an urban dweller, you can decide not to drive and thereby not to have to find somewhere to park your car where you have to pay for parking. Walk, cycle, or travel by bus, tram or taxi. Try it! If you don’t like the experience/costs/exercise, don’t whinge about the hassle and costs of car parking. Nothing is “free” these days.
This suggestion does not apply in many rural areas.
When you insure your vehicle, you are quoted a price for the policy. If you choose to pay monthly, you are entering into a credit agreement and are therefore liable for the total cost. Simples!!
Travel by public transport no expensive parking charges .Stop using pay car parks put the operators out of business Free car parking can always be found but you might have walk a short way Why do Blue badge holders pay to park when they can park for 3 hours on double yellow lines ?
So what about the buses and exact fare no change given
Prepaid cards are often available, for unlimited journeys during the period of validity. Would NCP do this? I doubt it.
The greed of local councils and parking operators constantly fleecing the motorist has got to be a major factor in the demise of the high street. I refuse to pay their ridiculous charges, so would rather walk a mile, or order online.
Birmingham City Council have recently changed their pay by phone operator. The previous company allowed you to terminate parking early and refund any overpayment, I. E. You pay for 3 hours when parking but return to the car after 2 hours and stop the parking on the phone app. However the new operator does not give this option so the only way not to overpay is to pay for the smallest time and keep extending on the app (if you remember!!)
The other matter is price jumping by large amounts when staying for a couple of minutes over the previous charge rate.. ie £2 fir first hour then 2 min over the hour £5. Why can’t prices run in 15minute intervals on a fixed charge per 15 min.
I’m surprised it’s only 700k a year. HMRC should take a closer look At their accounting in the first place.
The technology to give change has been around for decades. There are no excuses for not using it, so must be seen as a deliberate policy of the ncp.
In my view parking on public roads, which we already pay for, should be free, but limited by time where necessary. Purpose built car parks I can understand a need to recover costs, but not for shopping centres, hospitals and similar.
As the decline in High Streets continues, maybe retailers and car park operators could agree a mutually beneficial scheme where shoppers park for free for, say, 3 hours. This would attract far more people to town/city centres and boost trade. I live in a small town where the High Street is dying, yet the Council insist on charging for parking – this is why I go to supermarkets where the parking is free. Amazingly, the small stores near the town centre employ ParkingEye camera technology to further intimidate shoppers – and parking is strictly for 1 hour!! About time the war on motorists stopped and we can relax a bit more when we get behind the wheel.
This change needs to happen soon. It’s a long time ago that parking was so cheap at 10p an hour that this was trivial. Giving change is part of the solution but to complete the transformation to a fair system it has to be possible to pay for the parking you need: if it is £1 per hour it should be possible to pay 25p for 15 mins so you can drop dry cleaning or collect a takeaway. Change can’t be soon enough.
Now I know why Christchurch charge £3.10 for 2 hours parking! I thought it was incompetence…
Every car should have it’s number plate taken on parking and any over charge payed back directly to the person concerned the company concerned should have to pay for the equipment to do this they might just ues commen Sence for once
This is a blatant rip off. Can’t think of any other transaction where the vendor refuses to give change due. Then to go to Court to avoid paying tax ! Disgusting. Sorry Peter, but there is nothing ‘voluntary’ about it.
It should be illegal for them to keep payments made because of ‘no other option’. Their accountancy is obviously able to say how much is overpaid, this should be passed on to charity as that’s far easier than personal refunds. Drivers would be less annoyed if they knew their overpayment was going to a good cause. It would be good for the parking companies’ PR, as well!
Parking has cost me hundreds over the years working in and around city areas – I never seem to have the correct amount even though I used to have a pile of change kept in the car – mainly £1 coins as already stated by Gazza as smaller change in general is harder to come by for some reason – so in the main I have always overpaid. All parking areas should have contactless payment – any extras should be taxed.
I am not going to name the town in question, but I recently parked one evening in a carpark which offers free parking for a certain time and charges for longer, these charges applying between 7am and 7pm. No question about that. There was no statement anywhere in the carpark about evening charges, so I did not pay for my parking (and nor did others parking at the same time). However, I had already checked online and been informed that this car park DOES charge (a lower rate) for parking between 7pm and 7am. In this instance, either the local council in that town needs to post uptodate notices about parking charges, OR they need to make sure that online information is accurate. I don’t know what might have happened if some local officer had come along and seen cars not displaying tickets.
I am currently battling NPC regarding an alleged parking infringement. Basically I went to pick my wife up from the station, her train was cancelled so I had to wait an extra half hour or so, months later I got a penalty notice thru saying I hadn’t paid to park there. They issued it in my wife name as she’s registered driver, and I answered all the appeal questions online, thought noting more till a debt collections agency wrote saying they were seeking £160 or face court action. I contacted them and they relayed all the info back to NCP, we hear nothing more then today I get a demand from same debt collection agency asking for £160 or face legal action letter in my name this time. And the all edged offence was February last year!!!
Yes NCP a rip off and day light robbery company.